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Any Port in a Storm :: The Beacon :: Saving the World :: In nature, everything is connected
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AuthorTopic: In nature, everything is connected (Read 1,500 times)
bixaorellana
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In nature, everything is connected
« Thread Started on Aug 9, 2009, 2:14pm »		[Quote]
[image]

                http://www.nytimes.com/2009/08/09/opinio....&_r=1&th&emc=th
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bixaorellana
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Re: In nature, everything is connected
« Reply #1 on Nov 14, 2009, 11:48pm »		[Quote]
Hawaii's famed white sandy beaches are shrinking

This is an alarming news story!
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bixaorellana
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Re: In nature, everything is connected
« Reply #2 on Jun 11, 2010, 4:55pm »		[Quote]
I was surprised that there is not already a thread about genetically modified foods on this board.

Reading about the Amflora potato being allowed into the European Union should raise alarm. It's interesting that the latest update to the Wikipedia article was made this morning, after the potato story broke. The entry on Amflora says: Amflora will be produced solely under contract farming conditions and not made available on the general market. Be that as it may, how can it be guaranteed that Amflora genes won't escape? This report, from 2001, is just one of many that has kept concerned organizations fighting the incursion of GM corn from the US into Mexico.

Perhaps I'm a backward alarmist, but it seems the far-reaching effects of releasing these mutations across the globe is not yet known. The Dust Bowl in the US was partly caused by innovations in farming, which had short-term positive effects. The reliance on a single variety of potato helped feed the people of Ireland until a pathogen sneaked in.


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Re: In nature, everything is connected
« Reply #3 on Jun 11, 2010, 5:00pm »		[Quote]
Foods have been genetically modified for thousands of years. As have animals. Just because it is doesn't mean it's wrong. It's all a matter of degrees.
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bixaorellana
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Re: In nature, everything is connected
« Reply #4 on Jun 11, 2010, 5:32pm »		[Quote]
Point taken. The article linked in the OP addresses that to an extent.
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Re: In nature, everything is connected
« Reply #5 on Jun 11, 2010, 9:06pm »		[Quote]
Monsanto sues farmers whose crops have been contaminated with their proprietary genes, for not paying Monsanto for the use of those genes. Even though the farmer didn't want them and would pay NOT to have them!
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Re: In nature, everything is connected
« Reply #6 on Jun 12, 2010, 7:22am »		[Quote]
Did someone say Monsanto *Blocks ears*
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"Resentment is like drinking poison and then hoping it will kill your enemies."
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bixaorellana
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Re: In nature, everything is connected
« Reply #7 on Jun 12, 2010, 8:01am »		[Quote]
Monsanto's version of itself: http://www.monsanto.com/ (they have a gift shop!)

Another viewpoint: http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?tit...._and_Monopolism
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auntieannie
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Re: In nature, everything is connected
« Reply #8 on Jun 13, 2010, 12:27pm »		[Quote]
I am not again genetically modified in the old sense of the phrase.
GM the monsanto way is really really worrying.
It has potential effects not only on our health (as mentioned above, effects are not yet known), but on independant farmers - who are reduced to committing suicide, also on insects and other wildlife... and on the health of the earth that is supposed to feed us.

Why?
- there are tests currently being made to check if the worrying gradual disappearance of bees is linked to GM farming

- farmers in the third world have been conned into using these seeds that don't reproduce. It plunges them into poverty, to an extent they had never known before.

- intensive farming does not allow the earth to rest, it doesn't allow it to get nutrients back into it between crops.
The result is poor quality food and the need for more and more petrol-based chemical fertilisers to be used on an increasingly poor earth.

With reserves of petrol dwindling.. we may want to think forward to a way of using less petrochemicals in our food production. And what I understand about it is that uptodate organic farming sorts all the above points out.
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bixaorellana
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Re: In nature, everything is connected
« Reply #9 on Jun 13, 2010, 2:29pm »		[Quote]
There's been a fight for years over the introduction of gm corn into Mexico. This country is the birthplace of corn and the evolved varieties are matched to the various climates and conditions in this country. There is already evidence of contamination by the gm corn far from any areas where it should be found. The government here is notoriously disconnected from the reality of the lives of much of the population. Right here in the central valley of Oaxaca, home of the state capital, many farmers use oxen are used for plowing and have no irrigation. Laboratory-created varieties could destroy this kind of subsistence farming and offer nothing to replace it.
http://www.usnews.com/science/articles/2....ified-corn.html

After reading about the non-edible potato (linked in #2 above), I looked up potato starch. Of course I knew that the naturally occurring starch has been used in homes for centuries, but the starch of the little Frankenstein potato is mostly slated for crap "foods": http://www.theepochtimes.com/n2/content/view/9560/
Admittedly, some of the other ideas for use of the starch are interesting, but they're all in the research stage and several probably have hidden complications. And why is a potential time-bomb of genetic modification needed, when surplus food potato crops could be used instead?
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Don't tell me GM Technology is good
« Reply #10 on Jul 5, 2010, 6:51pm »		[Quote]
It's one hour long. If you do have the time, it's worth you watching this video.

http://video.yahoo.com/watch/259048/1923020
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Re: Don't tell me GM Technology is good
« Reply #11 on Jul 12, 2010, 5:57pm »		[Quote]
I haven't watched this whole film yet, BUT...

I think we need to be very wary of any assertion concerning the "goodness" or "badness" of a technology. Technologies are neither good nor bad. Once they have been developed however, it is critical that we manage their use and legislate and enforce against their misuse. They WILL NOT go away.
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Re: Don't tell me GM Technology is good
« Reply #12 on Jul 15, 2010, 4:46pm »		[Quote]
Annie, I have not been able to view this because of time constraints and most of all technical problems on my computer that are not allowing me to do a variety of things right now. But, I am very interested in the topic and will look at . Thanks for posting it. :)
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auntieannie
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Re: Don't tell me GM Technology is good
« Reply #13 on Jul 16, 2010, 6:10pm »		[Quote]
IMEC... agreed. the title of this thread is rather simplistic... I was paraphrasing what I hear so often around here.

This is good for you/ That is bad for you. This and that usually being the same thing at different times and following a "research" or another.
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Dans les grandes choses, les hommes se montrent comme il leur convient de se montrer; dans les petites, ils se montrent comme ils sont.
bixaorellana
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Re: In nature, everything is connected
« Reply #14 on Aug 10, 2010, 4:12pm »		[Quote]

Jun 13, 2010, 12:27pm, auntieannie wrote:
GM the monsanto way is really really worrying.

Not that more evidence was needed, but this blandly "reassuring" article will have you running around in furious, frustrated circles:

Canola, Pushed by Genetics, Moves Into Uncharted Territories <-- click
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Re: In nature, everything is connected
« Reply #15 on Oct 5, 2010, 5:57pm »		[Quote]
I think that it's okay to gloat about these misfortunes, don't you? :D
The article is infuriating because of its tone of acceptance for GM crops and for chemical controls of all kinds. Admittedly, it's from the Business section of the NYTimes, so can't be expected to pronounce on the ethics of tinkering with nature. Still, it's scary to once again be reminded of how wide-spread GM crops, Roundup, etc. are.
This is my abridgment. Click on the text for the complete article.

Jim Cramer, the television stock market commentator, [said] “This may be the worst stock of 2010,”

Monsanto, the giant of agricultural biotechnology, has been buffeted by setbacks this year that have prompted analysts to question whether its winning streak from creating ever more expensive genetically engineered crops is coming to an end.

The company’s stock [has] fallen about 42 percent since the beginning of the year.

The latest blow came last week, when early returns from this year’s harvest showed that Monsanto’s newest product, SmartStax corn, which contains an unprecedented eight inserted genes, was providing yields no higher than the company’s less expensive corn that contains only three foreign genes.

Monsanto has already been forced to sharply cut prices on SmartStax and on its newest soybean seeds, called Roundup Ready 2 Yield, as sales fell below projections.

But there is more. Sales of Monsanto’s Roundup, the widely used herbicide, have collapsed this year under an onslaught of low-priced generics made in China. Weeds are growing resistant to Roundup, dampening the future of the entire Roundup Ready crop franchise. And the Justice Department is investigating Monsanto for possible antitrust violations.

Until now, Monsanto’s main challenge has come from opponents of genetically modified crops, who have slowed their adoption in Europe and some other regions. Now, however, the outspoken critics also include farmers and investors who were once in Monsanto’s camp.

Monsanto used to introduce new seeds at a price that gave farmers two thirds and Monsanto one third of the extra profits that would come from higher yields or lower pest-control costs. But with SmartStax corn and Roundup Ready 2 soybeans, the company’s pricing aimed for a 50-50 split.

That backfired as American farmers grew only 6 million acres of Roundup Ready 2 soybeans this year, below the company’s goal of 8 million to 10 million acres, and only 3 million acres of SmartStax corn, below the goal of 4 million.

So now Monsanto is moving back to the older arrangement. SmartStax seed for planting next year will be priced at about only $8 an acre more than other seeds, down from about a $24 premium for this year’s seeds, Mr. Begemann said. The company will also offer credits for free seed to farmers who planted SmartStax this year and were disappointed.

Monsanto has also moved to offer farmers more varieties with fewer inserted genes. Some farmers have said they often have to buy traits they do notneed — such as protection from the corn rootworm in regions where that pest is not a problem — in order to get the best varieties. This issue has surfaced in the antitrust investigation.

[image]
Seth Perlman/Associated Press
Farmer Jerry McCulley refills his sprayer with the weed killer glyphosate on a farm near Auburn, Ill. A handful of hardy weeds have adapted to survive glyphosate, which many scientists say threatens to make the ubiquitous herbicide far less useful to farmers.
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Re: In nature, everything is connected
« Reply #16 on Feb 8, 2011, 5:43pm »		[Quote]
I've posted about this before (#9 above), but it needs to be harped upon. This article is datelined Guelatao -- Benito Juarez's birthplace. Whatever country you're in, you can probably point to some equally ironic way a place is celebrated even as its true patrimony is being trampled.
http://www.vancouversun.com/business/Mex....9017/story.html
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The Devil's Own
« Reply #17 on Mar 15, 2011, 7:40pm »		[Quote]
http://video.google.de/videoplay?docid=6262083407501596844&hl=de&emb=1#
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Dans les grandes choses, les hommes se montrent comme il leur convient de se montrer; dans les petites, ils se montrent comme ils sont.
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Re: The Devil's Own
« Reply #18 on Mar 15, 2011, 8:55pm »		[Quote]
Very interesting (although I did not have time to watch the entire documentary -- yet) -- Monsanto has been an ecological curse word in France for at least a decade, and probably in most of the rest of Europe as well.
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Re: The Devil's Own
« Reply #19 on Mar 15, 2011, 9:56pm »		[Quote]
This was shown on Arte last weekend, I think.

Amended to add I just couldn't turn it off, even though it made my blood boil.
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Dans les grandes choses, les hommes se montrent comme il leur convient de se montrer; dans les petites, ils se montrent comme ils sont.
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Re: The Devil's Own
« Reply #20 on Mar 27, 2011, 8:39pm »		[Quote]
roundup is just the "entrance ticket" into that documentary, K and bixa. but I would agree that many things said aren't new. just well explained, maybe?
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Re: The Devil's Own
« Reply #21 on Mar 27, 2011, 9:53pm »		[Quote]
Monsanto has a huge facility adjacent to one of the major highways in central Massachusetts. It looks like a small city and is one of the most frightening looking industrial complexes I have ever seen.
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Re: In nature, everything is connected
« Reply #22 on Sept 7, 2011, 7:20pm »		[Quote]
This is so infuriating, but hardly surprising:

New WikiLeaks Cables Show US Diplomats Promote Genetically Engineered Crops Worldwide
Click headline to read story.

And, just to make sure your blood is sufficiently chilled, read this:
http://gmwatch.org/latest-listing/1-news-items/13395-us-pushing-gmos-worldwide
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auntieannie
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Re: In nature, everything is connected
« Reply #23 on Sept 9, 2011, 6:37pm »		[Quote]
I'm not going to click on the links, bixa... not tonight. I need to sleep as tomorrow will be a long day.

I think I won't be surprised, though...
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Re: In nature, everything is connected
« Reply #24 on Sept 22, 2011, 5:04pm »		[Quote]
i haven't really read all the articles or watched the movies linked here, but just remembered how a few days ago someone was telling about something with genetic modification citing some example where they put genes of peanuts into some other plants... which just made me wonder: i know a few people that are very allergic to nuts - is it always ensured that these other food items stay save for them to eat? or will people with allergies one day have to shop in special stores to make sure they don't die from some random food seemingly unrelated to their allergy? but then again, maybe that's not how it works, i know nothing about the whole technology, after all...
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Re: In nature, everything is connected
« Reply #25 on Nov 16, 2011, 7:49pm »		[Quote]
This is beyond stunning in its beauty. Full screen, sound on, and don't take your eyes away for a second!

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Re: In nature, everything is connected
« Reply #26 on Nov 16, 2011, 8:56pm »		[Quote]
Thanks Bixa, that was absolutely wondrous wasn't it? It made me feel quite weepy! ::) Life is so very simple really...or it should be. I detest how we muck it up or adulterate everything. I really hope I come back as a humming bird next time around. Wouldn't that be brilliant?

Or maybe a Golden Eagle......or even the Bees Knees... 8-)
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Re: In nature, everything is connected
« Reply #27 on Nov 16, 2011, 9:58pm »		[Quote]
Oh -- you too?! Not something that I ever thought I'd be saying, but the bat sequence brought tears to my eyes.
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Re: In nature, everything is connected
« Reply #28 on Jan 4, 2012, 3:29am »		[Quote]
Peru takes a giant step: http://www.farmersguardian.com/home/late....u/43842.article
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Re: In nature, everything is connected
« Reply #29 on Mar 2, 2012, 3:29am »		[Quote]
Hooray for concerned French citizens: http://foodfreedom.wordpress.com/2010/08....y-gmo-vineyard/

But reading the whole article will make your blood boil once again because of our Big Friend M*ns*ant*.
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