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Post by onlymark on Sept 20, 2010 6:43:18 GMT
For a number of reasons I am now home schooling my 13 year old son. I will do so until January next year when he starts in a new school. Has anyone done this or been home schooled? Advantages/disadvantages from personal experience?
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Post by Deleted on Sept 20, 2010 7:16:53 GMT
My brother and I were home-schooled for one year, but it actually went beyond home-schooling: we were "self-schooled." The reason for this is that we spent a year with our grandparents in France, to learn more about the world and to learn to speak French properly. My mother being a high school teacher, she was able to get all of the necessary schoolbooks for US 8th grade and US 11th grade. We would study in the morning and a little bit after lunch, but we definitely did not try to follow exact school hours.
It actually worked out quite well, but the main reason is that we were both good in school and did not have any comprehension problems. My big brother had clearly received instructions to oversee what I was doing, which I resisted to the utmost. Our mother would get copies of various tests throughout the year and send them to us -- they were generally a snap.
Anyway, we returned to normal high school the next year without incident, except for the terrible fact that I had missed the driver's ed class that was given in 8th grade and which was obligatory to be able to get a drivers license at age 16. I had to wait until I was 18!
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Post by onlymark on Sept 20, 2010 8:13:51 GMT
"we were both good in school and did not have any comprehension problems."
Aye, there's the rub - is the Shakespearean expression.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 20, 2010 8:21:28 GMT
I suppose he is good in certain subjects and not so good in others? I had an aversion to math and history but I was still able to learn that crap. I would have enormous difficulty if I had to try to help somebody with math now -- I pretty much evacuated it from my brain as soon as I was sure that I would not be needing most of it for the rest of my life.
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Post by onlymark on Sept 20, 2010 9:25:41 GMT
The poor lad has suffered from a succession of less than effective teachers. One of the drawbacks from living an expat life, and in Egypt, and that my kids go to a German school is that compared to USA/UK schools there are fewer to choose from, plus due to pay, location and conditions the schools here are only attractive to a smaller amount of qualified teachers and doesn't appeal to many mainstream ones. Thus the pool to choose from is less and the likelyhood of getting a poor one is greater as the pool is polluted by the cast off ones that can't get a good job in Germany, the old and retired, the part timers, those that aren't committed to staying and only want to do it for a year or less, non German teachers etc.
(I say non German ones but that is fine when the subject is religion, arabic, french, english, even history/geography - but when the last German teacher he had, to teach the German language, was Hungarian and no-one could understand her, well it got a bit much)
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Post by Deleted on Sept 20, 2010 13:48:32 GMT
Those private schools get away with murder in a lot of countries, because there are not enough people qualified to recognize who is unqualified.
Meanwhile, I do know that the most important thing for the "difficult" subjects is to make them interesting and entertaining rather than trying to hammer them in. The study of the German language is enjoying a resurgence in France due to the popularity of the group Tokio Hotel -- the teen girls all want to learn and understand the lyrics, the same way pop culture helped the study of English throughout Europe. But a lot of schools think that they should teach Goethe instead.
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Post by onlymark on Sept 20, 2010 15:51:51 GMT
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Post by bixaorellana on Sept 20, 2010 15:57:08 GMT
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Post by onlymark on Sept 20, 2010 16:48:58 GMT
I'll shall have a look at them after I've done my lesson preparation and exercise marking.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 20, 2010 16:55:39 GMT
Buy some extra red pens.
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Post by lola on Sept 20, 2010 19:46:19 GMT
Hi, oM,
Both of my girls ended up being pretty much homeschooled all along. Both are now in college/university, awarded (pardon seeming immodesty) the highest academic scholarships at their institutions. They have other good qualities, in my opinion, of course. I feel that they are more independent and enthusiastic learners because of the self-learning/unschooling experience.
It started when we lived in a school district that had a bad reputation, and I thought we'd keep our oldest at home for a couple of years while she toughened up a little, figuring I could handle academic rigors through second grade. I worked weekends and/or evenings for pay when my husband could be home.
One thing that made it rewarding all those years was the network we joined, then the only secular one among many Christian ones in our area. We had learning co-ops, field trips, plays, kickball games. Also both girls took ballet, music, French and other paid classes to supplement and widen their social acquaintance.
In high school, we were fortunate to live in a district that let them take science and math classes only, as they wished. My younger girl especially was frustrated there with amount of time wasted with going over the homework she had already done, disciplining, general busy work, and neither had any desire to spend more time in high school. They both also at age 16 started part time classes at a community college, and it helped their self esteem when they did well there.
If you have any specific questions, I'd be happy to help in any way. I think your son will do just fine, and even thrive.
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Post by lola on Sept 21, 2010 2:39:11 GMT
My main advice boils down to: take it easy, enjoy your time being with and talking with him, and trust him to focus on what interests him.
I don't mean let him watch TV or play video games all day. But kids his age do just fine without a curriculum. I have friends whose mornings are spent browbeating their children into finishing so many pages of this workbook or that many math problems, and it's an unnecessarily uphill battle that breeds rebellion.
Expose him to good writing, attend public events and discuss what went on. If you take him to a museum, to the market, or out driving in the desert, and point out things that interest you, and why, that would be a productive day.
For all the hours my girls did not spend doing math homework, they still quickly picked up the concepts and got A's when they were in formal mathematics classes. I don't mean to paint them as geniuses, because others in our group had similar success after similarly loose preparation and lots of real life experiences.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 21, 2010 5:16:41 GMT
I agree that any "event" is educational, and my grandparents understood that. Any trip to the big city (Metz) or mushroom hunting in the cow pastures or picking hazelnuts in the woods was considered to be highly educational and trumped formal book study every time.
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Post by onlymark on Sept 21, 2010 5:20:29 GMT
You're right in that it does seem to benefit many kids, though I suppose not all. His two younger sisters still go to the same school as normal but have different teachers, ones who at the moment seem fine. I have now seen there is a 'support structure' from parents in a similar situation but whilst here it can only be via the internet as there aren't exactly many of us in the country/city to form a group to do things, but that's not an insurmountable problem.
One wrinkle though is my son has ADHD/ADHS and this is one of the contributory factors as to why he is now at home where I can more readily tailor his education to his needs and provide an environment with fewer distractions. The techniques required to control the impulses and other effects of ADHD don't easily translate to a school classroom where the child has to try and accomplish this himself rather than having help in doing so, after all, the teachers cannot devote all their time to one or two pupils, whereas I can.
He is being taught the curriculum according to the German education authorities and the books we have are fairly straightforward and set out section by section in a well organised way. A way that I can follow quite well, though Google Translate is a tool I have to refer to quite often. The biggest problem, as with most teenagers, is getting him up in a morning.
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Post by onlymark on Sept 21, 2010 5:26:35 GMT
K2, missed your post as I was posting. Yes, 'field trips' are useful and we will do them from time to time, especially because I like to get out of the house anyway. One lesson that is not on the curriculum but I'm doing anyway is 'Domestic Science' - I'm teaching him how to cook and clean and iron and wash and mend clothes, all the stuff around the house that a single person needs to survive. It'll also stand him in good stead throughout his life, as it has me when my mother taught me.
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Post by Jazz on Sept 21, 2010 12:16:14 GMT
Four months isn’t long and could well be a remarkable experience for both of you. Your idea of teaching him Domestic science is great! (rare these days, especially for boys.) I like the idea of a loose curriculum enriched with field trips. Children are so often underestimated and it is fascinating to see where a child’s mind goes when not forced into a box because of expediency. (35 students, one teacher, time restrictions, budget etc). The only possible problem here is that when he again attends a formal school he may find it unstimulating compared to a few months of what I consider true learning, that of experience as opposed to being limited to books and working on computers. Of course, they are all important, but personally I always absorbed the most one-on-one and with actual experience. I can understand your concern with the quality of teachers given your situation. But, I think this is outweighed by the gift of the experience of being brought up within another culture. Just by osmosis, this enhances his ability to adapt and understand at a more accelerated pace. My own experience was ‘self taught’ rather than home schooled. Each winter, my parents would go to Florida (US) to work, they did this for 8 years, from when I was age 8-16 (grade 12). So, each year, I attended my Canadian school for Sept/Oct., then was put into a different American school each year from Nov-March. Of course, the US schools had a totally different curriculum. When I returned home in April, I then had to ‘catch up’ on 5 months of the Can. Curriculum in order to write my final exams for the year. It always worked out but I had to study very hard, but I did finish first in my class in grade 12. The most difficult was not catching up, but the social aspect…leaving my friends, trying to make new friends, leaving them and trying to fit in once again at home, over and over again. Not being around his friends may or may not be a bit of a problem for your son, I don’t know how isolated your situation is. I think that you can make this a great adventure for him and 4 months will pass quickly. If you can get him out of bed!
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Post by lola on Sept 22, 2010 13:26:18 GMT
I think Jazz's, Kerouac's and, to a more limited degree, my daughters' schooling experiences show that there are lots of ways to be well educated.
I hope you and your son can enjoy this time together without too much agony or coercion, and that he can use this rare opportunity to explore his own interests as deeply as he wants. The luxury of homeschooling is being able to tailor it to his nature.
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Post by onlymark on Sept 22, 2010 13:43:34 GMT
We did some maths and physics today. It was a hard day as we're moving on from just doing pure calculation to using reasoning to find out what is needed from a question put in the form of sentences - practical maths and stuff. Not so easy and takes a lot of explaining and examples.
E.g. If I can run 150 metres in 20 seconds and you can run 100 metres in 15 seconds, who can run the fastest? (The answer isn't Usain Bolt)
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2010 14:01:01 GMT
Well, since I'm only going 24 km/h while you're going 27 km/h, it must be you!
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Post by onlymark on Sept 22, 2010 15:09:36 GMT
But the answer needed was in m/s.
And no calculator.
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Post by lola on Sept 22, 2010 17:12:53 GMT
Oh, so now you expect everyone to prove they're well educated, after I've been bragging about them?
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Post by bixaorellana on Sept 26, 2010 4:38:58 GMT
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Post by onlymark on Sept 26, 2010 5:41:43 GMT
I'd not seen that. I have to ask to join, so I've winged off a note to them and we'll see what happens. Thanks a lot.
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Post by lola on Sept 27, 2010 14:32:02 GMT
One down side of home school teaching is the emotional involvement, like when your child doesn't grasp a concept and you flash mentally forward to her future in fast food service, giving an extra edge to the voice.
I remember telling my younger girl that you had to do the same thing to both sides of the equation, whereupon she burst into tears.
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Post by onlymark on Sept 27, 2010 14:45:11 GMT
You have to do the same thing to the both sides of an equation?
Shit, I better correct my mistake and give him some extra hours of tuition.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 27, 2010 16:38:01 GMT
Lola, you could have made her cry twice as long by saying that you have to do the same thing to both sides but make it look completely different.
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Post by tod2 on Oct 2, 2010 12:43:42 GMT
This is a most interesting thread and I wish Mark the very best of luck with stepping into 'school shoes'.
My sister and I are 2 years apart but our little brother was 13 years my junior. We were both shipped off to boarding school (early 1960). My brother was left on the farm with my parents and come school age, my mother took on the challenge (and believe me it was) of home-schooling my brother. This turned out to be a disaster as constant interruptions took place. My father would walk in and say " Daniel, I'm off to go and look at some cows on the next farm - want to come with me?" Well, my mother stood no chance and when the year came to an end the decision was made to send him off to boarding school as well. This was not a happy situation for a lad of 6 or 7years old and after many tears my parents gave up the farm and moved to a smaller farm nearer our city to enable him to be 'a day boy'.
That was then, but I look around at the high school less than 1 km down the road from my house & I wonder where have all the european children gone? Only a handful of white faces are evident amongst the African & Asian pupils. Whats the reason and where are they at school now? Maybe to a few to private schools but I think most are being home-schooled.
Great pity in my opinion. I believe that children, especially high school pupils, should be in regular school for the simple reason they learn to get on with their peers, plus regular sporting activities give them a sense of team spirit. Unless there is no other option I would put home schooling at the bottom of my list.
I'll go one step further and say that if and where possible, high scoolers should be away from parents and distractions in the home - TV, arguing & fighting parents, late nights and little discipline in a lot of cases.
These are just my private thoughts on a particular situation in South Africa.
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Post by onlymark on Oct 2, 2010 13:25:05 GMT
Home schooling was at the bottom of our list too. We have tried to avoid it but to give him a reasonable standard of education it is the only option until he starts another school in January. He can't go to that school now as places are fought over and one is not available until then. I'd rather do this at home than leave him in the school he is as week by week he was falling further behind. To emphasise, this isn't a long term solution, it's a stop gap.
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Post by betsie on Oct 2, 2010 14:04:57 GMT
I agree with your general opinion on home schooling, Tod. It's ok in situations where you have practically no choice and it's only temporary, but kids should be in school for social reasons and to get away from parenting for part of the day, which is always pretty intense, no matter how hard we try to ease up. Even if schools are not as good as we could wish, kids with stable and loving families will turn out alright and function well in society if they are exposed to and participate in the general experience of their own generation.
The cases of home schooling I've seen on TV and also with friends of mine were nearly all cases in which the parents were far too idealistic and didn't want their kids exposed to ideas they themselves didn't like.
I had friends who went to live in a country cottage with no electricity or gas, became vegans, grew their own food, made themselves outcasts in their village by their uncompromising and critical attitude towards the lifestyles and beliefs of the villagers, and home schooled their 3 kids because schools were just not good enough for them. Those kids grew up in a medieval bubble and I often wonder how they turned out as adults.
Home schooling is not allowed at all in the Netherlands. We have no private schools either, even members of the royal family attend normal state schools, albeit in wealthy areas. We have a wide variety of schools here, based on religion (including Islamic schools) or on educational approach, like Rudolph Steiner schools, Montessori schools, etc., and unlike the UK, we have total freedom in choosing any school we wish for our children.
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Post by tod2 on Oct 2, 2010 14:26:31 GMT
Yes Mark, I absolutely understood you are doing this for a specific reason and no criticism was directed at you personally - I apolgise if I gave the wrong message! I admire your undertaking and could never see myself having the fortitude to embrace such a task.
Betsie - Your statement about idealistic parents I think sums it up pretty much for a lot of homeschooling here. Some I have met are doing it for religious reasons (as if others who don't share your beliefs will be a bad influence on you) or think the school system is rotten to the core, which in some instances it is. Teachers arrive in class to persue a second career and use the school as an office. This is not the case at the school down the road from me. It is very well run.
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