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Post by questa on Oct 9, 2013 2:10:58 GMT
On the way to Bisotun we stopped at another rock inscription. I chose not to do the climb but was impressed by my camera's zoom lens.
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Post by questa on Oct 9, 2013 2:35:11 GMT
Then on to Bisotun... "UNESCO World Heritage site Bisotun is located along the ancient trade route linking the Iranian high plateau with Mesopotamia and features remains from the prehistoric times to the Median, Achaemenid, Sassanian, and Ilkhanid periods. The principal monument of this archaeological site is the bas-relief and cuneiform inscription ordered by Darius I, The Great, when he rose to the throne of the Persian Empire, 521 BC. The carvings were very well protected by the arched caves.
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Post by questa on Oct 9, 2013 5:37:43 GMT
The Iranian people were very hospitable and friendly. It was holiday time for them and there were lots of picnics in the parks. We were offered food by almost everyone However, a time came when most of us needed a 'nature stop' and we were far from any facilities. A clutch of old buildings, a herd of goats and nowhere to 'go' We stood in the shade While our driver parlayed with the home-owner Eventually a lad led us to the WC Past the sick goats and a pen for some other creature We reached our goal, but I'm sure you can imagine the rest so I will stop right here!
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Post by lugg on Oct 9, 2013 18:20:17 GMT
What a treat both visually and to read. Thank you Questa for taking the time to post.
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Post by questa on Oct 9, 2013 21:44:47 GMT
Thank you Lugg, I hope the thread is interesting to others as well. I don't want it to come across as a dead history lesson. The local people are so proud of their country's story that they would take time to tell us about each feature and then move away while we took photos. I had about 4 different students explaining the bas-reliefs at Bisotun to me at various points (and debating the details among themselves)
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Post by questa on Oct 9, 2013 22:42:57 GMT
Waking up in Kermanshah, we found ourselves in fog. The river Ghare_Soo runs through the city. We set out for Ahvaz. The Iraqi border is not far away...about 127km from Basrah. The wide, straight roads have been built to be used as aircraft runways if needed. Looking right Looking left They built a massive bridge, but only the ends remain.
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Post by htmb on Oct 9, 2013 23:24:53 GMT
This continues to be fascinating, but I find my brain only able to absorb so much information at a time. Was it absolutely overwhelming for you to be on this trip, Questa? I'm sure, for me, much of what I'd seen would not fully sink in until way after the trip was over and I'd had a chance to process what I'd seen.
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Post by questa on Oct 9, 2013 23:31:52 GMT
The city of Ahvaz does not have a lot going for it. Heavy industry and nearby oil wells have made it the most polluted city in the world. "The choking orange smog that routinely descends on Ahwaz City is familiar to its inhabitants whose quality of life and longevity are under attack from the noxious fumes of unbridled industrial development. In terms of suffocating air pollution, Ahwaz outstrips Beijing and Delhi by a long stretch, according to the latest findings of the World Health Organisation (WHO)". It does, however, have the tomb of the prophet Daniel (he of the den of lions fame) which is ott compared to Esther's. Women enter by one door and men by the other. Each side has a carpeted large room where people can relax. Then you enter the room with the tomb..The room is divided lengthwise by curtains so each gender sees one side of the tomb only. It is surmounted by the blue and gold fabric. We were hustled through the small chamber which made for rotten photos. Daniel is regarded as one of the prophets in Islamic scripture so his tomb is given the 'treatment'.
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Post by questa on Oct 9, 2013 23:46:34 GMT
Thanks htmb, I think I must be lucky to process stuff quickly. This also has to do with my reading up on the history for weeks before I go to a country, so when I get to a site I have a head start on its story. I am a real pest for always asking questions of our guides, too. They seem to like the fact that I have done some 'homework' before the trip and point out things to me separately.
There are always surprises, though.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 9, 2013 23:51:05 GMT
I got lost in the magnificent cliffs back at #30 and then the beautifully sculpted stones. And that always makes one Wonder when they are capable of such incredible beauty why so many 20th/21st century constructions are made out of those really ugly cement blocks or poorly shaped stones. It just seems like they would have time to do something better, since we know that nothing that isn't a government project ever gets built fast. (And even most government projects take forever.)
Daniel's tomb in Ahvaz is really impressive.
I have fantasized about travelling through these regions for years. This report makes it look simultaneously easy and difficult!
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Post by bixaorellana on Oct 10, 2013 2:43:13 GMT
This continues to be a real eye-opener, Questa. What good advice about boning up on the history before going on such a trip.
Even the ruins, such as the bridge, are an amazing testament to ancient power and engineering skills. What a tragedy that many of the modern people have to live in bleak and polluted conditions.
The bas-reliefs are beyond beautiful. Love your zoom pic of the towering cliff.
Are those mirrors in Daniel's tomb, or is it silver? Or are the reflections from the glaze on the tiles? Is the clay-colored tower older than the rest of the site?
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Post by questa on Oct 10, 2013 4:46:44 GMT
K2... I am watching our state Govt knocking down buildings that I watched them build 45 years ago. "they don't properly serve their purpose anymore". They weren't aesthetically or historically special.
Today's buildings are thrown up knowing they need a life span of 60 or so years, so why not just throw it together with the cheapest adequate materials?
When the ancients built, they had eternity in mind. They expected their great buildings to last forever.
"My name is Ozymandias, king of kings. Look on my works, ye mighty, and despair"
Didn't do him much good though! However we still remember his name.
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Post by questa on Oct 10, 2013 4:59:13 GMT
Bixa
Not mirrors, it seemed to be a silver metallic sheet on the surface. There is some ceramic tile reflections, specially near the tomb itself, they are more of a gold colour.
The whole place is used as a religious school and mosque, with the courtyard being the place to do their prayers. I should think that the minaret and building were done at the same time, maybe replacing an earlier one. The tile patterns are old ones.
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Post by questa on Oct 10, 2013 7:30:23 GMT
]The modern name is Shush, but it was called Susa all through the ages. I have pulled a potted history together. In historic literature, Susa appears in the very earliest Sumerian records. Archeologists have dated the first traces of an inhabited Neolithic village to c 7000 BCE. Evidence of a painted-pottery civilization has been dated to c 5000 BCE. It is also mentioned in the Ketuvim of the Hebrew Bible by the name Shushan. Both Daniel and Nehemiah lived in Susa during the Babylonian captivity of the 6th century BCE.
French Archeologists Quarters, base walls being restored Greek mythology attributed the founding of Susa to king Memnon of Aethiopia, a character from Homer's Trojan War epic, the Iliad.
The city forms the setting of The Persians (472 BCE), an Athenian tragedy by the ancient Greek playwright Aeschylus that is the oldest surviving play in the history of theatreFertility goddess In 647 BCE, the Assyrian king Assurbanipal leveled the city during a war "Susa, the great holy city, abode of their gods, seat of their mysteries, I conquered. I entered its palaces, I opened their treasuries where silver and gold, goods and wealth were amassed... I destroyed the ziggurat of Susa. I smashed its shining copper horns. I reduced the temples of Elam to naught; their gods and goddesses I scattered to the winds. The tombs of their ancient and recent kings I devastated, I exposed to the sun, and I carried away their bones toward the land of Ashur. I devastated the provinces of Elam and on their lands I sowed salt."Susa underwent a major political and ethnocultural transition when it became part of the Persian Achaemenid empire between 540 and 539 BCE when it was captured by Cyrus the Great Susa lost much of its importance when Alexander of Macedon conquered it in 331 AD and destroyed the first Persian Empire. Susa became a frequent place of refuge for Parthian and later, the Persian Sassanid kings from the Romans (Susa was briefly captured only by Roman emperor Trajan in 116 AD and never again would the Roman Empire advance so far to the east). Susa was destroyed at least three times in its history. The first was in 647 BCE, by Assyrians. The second destruction took place in 638 CE, when the Muslim armies first conquered Persia. In 1218, the city was razed by invading Mongols. Next stop - the ziggurat
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Post by mossie on Oct 10, 2013 10:51:41 GMT
This is all totally overwhelming to me, my classical education is virtually nil. I was amazed to see an angel with wings in the rock carvings.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 10, 2013 14:23:55 GMT
Wonderful photos, questa. Thanks for telling us more about your travels there. It's really opened my eyes to a country I had previously thought little about. My nephew has a business in Dubai where he has been living for the last several years. These are areas I would really like to see some time in the future.
I really like the dry desert looking surroundings. I was just wondering about the water over there. Do they get shortages at all? Where does their drinking water come from? Is it all from underground?
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Post by questa on Oct 11, 2013 12:05:56 GMT
The great ziggerat at Susa (Shush) is called Chogha Zanbil A careless step on a mud brick not quite dry, thousands of years ago and a worker's footprint makes it to the 21st century Drainage channels are built in everywhere. To bar the doors, heavy logs were passed through these loops on either side of the door. ______________________________________________________________ It was a busy day with a lot of walking and I was getting excited...tomorrow we go to Shiraz, second only to Esfahan for gardens, poetry, nightingales and flasks of wine...well in the Golden Age anyway!
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Post by spindrift on Oct 11, 2013 15:42:50 GMT
I have spent ages enjoying your thread, questa. I do not know much about Iran/Persia but I do know that it is considered to be one of the birthplaces of civilization several thousand years ago. The countryside looks so parched; do you think it ever becomes green? where are the crops grown? When you were travelling long distances was it easy to find petrol or have snacks? What did you eat? Where did you stay? I'm longing to hear all of this. Did you find anything to do with the Zoastrian faith? Any other faiths?
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Post by questa on Oct 11, 2013 23:41:36 GMT
Thank you, Spindrift There are many rivers that carry the snow melt down to the valleys so it is a seasonal thing. We were there at the dry time, and drove through lots of arid areas.The cities and towns would have started life as oases on the trade routes, where water was permanent. The presence of pools, lakes and fountains in the cities show the respect they had for water. Water was carried in covered stone channels and aqueducts to large deep wells with steps leading down to water level. These were covered with stone domes to prevent evaporation. In some parts of Central Asia big loads of hay covered snow would be brought from the mountains and put in these wells to provide water over summer. Earlier in this thread there were some shots of crops, just out of Tehran. Hey! you are talking about the oldest trade routes in history. The locals know where to a metre they should establish their "tea houses" Just when you feel like a break, up pop small restaurants with gardens, fountains and great food. Motor fuel was readily available at gas stations with 10+ pumps, roads and infrastructure was excellent. Lots of roadside sellers of all sorts of fruit and parks to have picnics in. I'll cover food and hotels a bit later. Sure did! I'm 'doing' this trip in chronological order and the best is yet to come. We visited the main temple and the Towers of Silence...but you are going to have to wait or I'll get confused!! Here is a little teaser
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Post by questa on Oct 11, 2013 23:54:30 GMT
Deyana, maybe I answered your questions about the water as well? If not, ask away Here is a pic for you Char Minar Mosque, Khiva, Uzbekistan
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Post by Deleted on Oct 12, 2013 0:48:17 GMT
You have indeed answered my question, questa. Thanks.
mmm... that tray of food does look good.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 12, 2013 0:51:36 GMT
And the Char Minar Mosque! Good one.
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Post by questa on Oct 12, 2013 2:41:17 GMT
For Spindrift... I would not have thought of posting these but I welcome any questions and pointers on what you would like to see. (That goes for everybody) How far it is to next fuel stop, written in English and Farsi Our driver's cockpit. His speed monitor. It does a full record of what speed the bus is doing, when and for how long the bus was stationary. About every 80km there was a check point like in the one above (red notice in distant right) where his record was downloaded. While we waited this chap and his mate on a mandolin "entertained" us. I never got bored.
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Post by questa on Oct 12, 2013 5:42:56 GMT
We woke in Ahvaz to a thick, stinking smog, so hit the road quickly Even the sheep didn't like it. There were some mobile medical offices around We were flagged down by a uniformed woman, who gave us masks with instructions to wear them until our driver said it was all clear And that's as much you will see of me! Even the fountain seemed discouraged by it all.
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Post by questa on Oct 12, 2013 8:45:34 GMT
When Alexander the Great tried to cross the mountains to take the land beyond, he didn't know of this hidden pass. His army was stuck for ages until a local man said he'd show the pass for a cash reward. After being shown the only way through the mountains, Alex had the informant killed for being a traitor to his people. (Ethics 101...discuss) Just when you need a break...up pops a "tea house". We ate beneath a vine covered pergola beside a duck pond. On the outskirts of Shiraz we stopped for a peek at this former mansion. It was after sunset and the gardens didn't show up well in the light. From our hotel balcony, my room mate observed that the locked gate of the lovely gardens across the road could be climbed over. When it was dark we quietly entered and looked at the gardens in their flood lighting. Then we heard men's voices approaching so we scuttled back to the hotel.
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Post by spindrift on Oct 12, 2013 20:17:34 GMT
Hi questa! Thanks for the extra information and pictures which I find very interesting. You and your friend were daring if not foolish to climb over the locked gates into the gardens....I think that is what you did? I'd be wary of getting shot at! The tea house looks lovely with water and ducks providing an illusion of coolness; that service station is indeed enormous; I have never seen one so large and the roads look good. Was that a dust storm you were driving through? I guess it wasn't a fog. The food looks yummy. I see there is saffron on the rice. Were you served fresh fruit? dates? figs? What was a average temperature during the day/night? If you stopped at a shop along the way to buy something, did the people understand English? I somehow doubt it. Why did you choose to visit Iran? Did you find the people friendly? Did you buy any turquoises? sorry for all the questions!
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Post by Deleted on Oct 12, 2013 22:16:43 GMT
I love the idea of "pollution solution" being a uniformed woman who hands out masks!
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Post by questa on Oct 13, 2013 0:25:56 GMT
The people are all very friendly and hospitality is a cornerstone to their culture. They don't carry guns. If caught, we were going to say we were short cutting to our hotel. Probably we would have been invited to drink tea with them and given an escort back. It was filthy pollution just as we were leaving Ahvaz. A few posts back I inserted a note from WHO saying that Ahvaz has the worst air pollution in the world. Lots of fruit...full on in the melon season with about 7 different varieties being sold by the roadside, apricots, pomegranates and all the usual fruits. You could buy dates and figs, pistachios, cashews and other nuts at the little market shops, They also have many different sweets as well. I really don't know! I wore the required very wafty, lightweight long pants, long-sleeved, hips covering top (in fact they were night gowns bought at an op-shop before I left) and instead of a triangular scarf to cover my head, I used a Cambodian krama which is a long, checquered, very light cotton scarf which I always take when travelling. I didn't feel too hot or cold, but there was a/c in the bus and hotels. I would guess at 35 C by day. Apart from the very primitive "nature stop" already posted, everyone I met spoke very good English. There were lots of picnics going on and we were invited to eat with so many strangers. I think it must be a required language in schools as even the little kids were using it with us. Mainly because of the history and wanting to see for myself what the country was really like now. We get so much negative information from the media. The people still remember the anguish of the long Iraq/Iran wars of a few years ago and they certainly don't share in the sabre-rattling of their leaders. Also...because it does not have a MacDonalds! (I prefer to visit countries where the golden arches have not appeared) Yes, the people are friendly...and just like us No to the turquoise, but I did get some little elephants for my collection.
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Post by fumobici on Oct 13, 2013 2:56:03 GMT
At the risk of a thread hijacking... Cool 45 minute video on modern Iran. I can't believe the US and Israel can even think about bombing this fascinating, beautiful, ancient and cosmopolitan culture unprovoked that hasn't attacked anyone else in over 200 years. Sorry for the digression but sometimes the West is just evil.
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Post by questa on Oct 13, 2013 4:20:38 GMT
Fumobici
OH...WOW! That didn't hijack the thread but showed professionally what I have been bumbling along to say. Like the Jewish politician says towards the end, "you have to change your ideas."
Another thing I have forgotten to note (planned it for some later pics) The women are stunningly beautiful, the hejab is a very flattering garment...it draws attention to the eyes and face. The young women I talked with all wanted to keep wearing it. There is a drift away from the black burqa to other colours and the embroidery and decoration with beads etc on even the black ones is beautiful. I only saw 2 women with the full face slitted burqas and was told they were visiting from another country anyway.
I hope everyone here watches that video, It shows things far better than I can.
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