|
Post by htmb on Jan 19, 2014 21:18:10 GMT
I would like to open a discussion on areas in France that you have either visited and loved, or that you have always dreamed of visiting, confining the area to a section from Orleans, southwest to Nantes, south to Bordeaux, east to Clermont-Ferrand, and north again. I'm looking for suggestions for me and friends who will be traveling together later this year for a week. I know this is a really broad question, but would love to get some input from the very knowledgeable members here. Links to AnyPort reports and/or other helpful websites would also be much appreciated. I'm not looking for anyone to do my work for me, but only wish to know what you might recommend for my future planning explorations.
One of my friends is French and has visited much of this area, but not all. My friends have spent a lot of time at La Rochelle in the past and enjoyed it very much. We are very casual people, looking for beautiful, interesting and historic places off the beaten path. We all enjoy walking, great photo opportunities, and a good bottle of wine, and we don't care for crowds. We anticipate taking a train from Paris and will then rent a car. At the end of the week I will take the train back to Paris.
My friends and I will be meeting soon to discuss ideas. There are so many places in France I have not visited that I could go just about anywhere and be happy, but I've been asked to make some suggestions in the process of narrowing down the focus. I've been working through the many wonderful AnyPort reports and I have several books and links to review already. A week is not much time, so we will probably narrow down the visit to one or two closely connected areas. I suspect we will be traveling more towards the southern boundary of the parameters I mentioned above, rather than the northern.
I would love to hear from you and, of course, I will happily file a trip report afterwards, if not during.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 20, 2014 7:27:28 GMT
In one fell swoop, you managed to mention the names of four cities that I do not really care for, so I had to display a map of France on Google to see what other places that I could talk about are within reach of these cities. Of the four, I would say that Nantes is the most interesting. I will also admit that I have avoided all of these cities for at least the last 15 years, so anything I could say about them first hand is most certainly completely out of date.
How will you be travelling around France?
|
|
|
Post by bjd on Jan 20, 2014 7:35:04 GMT
I must say I agree with Kerouac -- about Clermont-Ferrand and Bordeaux. It's true that Bordeaux has improved a lot in the past 15 years -- the river waterfront has been cleaned, slums across the river were torn down and an arboretum has been put there -- but it's still not a great and interesting city.
And I personally don't like cities built of dark stone, so C-F is out.
I discovered Nantes for the first time in 2012 and quite liked it, but the photos in the thread I made about it have all been erased last time I looked. It's a nice place, but then, anywhere near the ocean is nice in my opinion.
If it were up to me, I would go to southwestern France, well south of Bordeaux -- Bayonne/Biarritz and the Basque area. You have ocean, mountains within a very short drive, the Spanish border is less than 50 km away, letting you pop over to San Sebastian for tapas and a walk. Easy train connections from Paris.
I suppose this will be in June?
|
|
|
Post by htmb on Jan 20, 2014 13:16:15 GMT
Sorry I wasn't clear. There is no intent to travel to any of those cities except a train station here and there and a quick stop to see family. The cities were only used as markers. It's the little, out of the way places in between we are looking at going. I wish we could go further south, bjd, but can't on this trip. Kerouac, we will be traveling to an area by train and then picking up a rental car.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 20, 2014 13:30:25 GMT
Ah, a rental car makes everything much better. Near Nantes, you need to go to the coast to see places like Pornic or the island of Noirmoutier. If you are lucky and it is low tide, you can even venture across the Passage du Gois. I managed to do it once. It is a road to Noirmoutier that goes underwater at high tide. (Don't worry; there are signs and attendants to advise you if you can do it.) www.passagedugois.com/
|
|
|
Post by htmb on Jan 20, 2014 14:08:00 GMT
That looks interesting. Is it a one-way road to the island? I assume there's a bridge at the other connection to the island. Correct?
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 20, 2014 15:09:29 GMT
|
|
|
Post by htmb on Jan 20, 2014 20:31:44 GMT
I appreciate the beautiful map, Kerouac, and thanks for the tip, tetsyd. While I do love the water, I live in Florida so do my best to avoid the combination of both water AND tourist trap! Hence, so many photos of places like Cedar Key, Cumberland Island, and St. Marys.
Quiet, scenic areas near the west coast with lots of interesting waterfowl and landscapes to photograph, and/or some of the scenic little villages off the typical tourist routes would be to my taste. I should have some specific areas to list for consideration soon since we will be meeting later today.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 20, 2014 21:06:58 GMT
Well, "tourist trap" can be applied to every single coastal area in France and naturally all of Paris by the definition of some people. I try to think of these places as popular tourist destinations, usually with good reason. If you want to go somewhere that no tourist would ever want to go, I can certainly give a list of those places. For quiet tourist areas with wildlife, I would recommend the Somme, but it is north of your zone. On the other hand, the swamps of the Poitevin area are reputedly wonderful, and they even have swamp boat wetland area tours. I have never been on those tours, but I am still convinced that they are great. (Poitevin = area around Poitiers) If ever you were in that area, I would even recommend the Futuroscope as something to see. It is a theme park, and believe it or not, Disney actually sniffs around there to get some ideas for their own attractions. en.futuroscope.com/
|
|
|
Post by htmb on Jan 20, 2014 21:14:36 GMT
Oh, good idea! I will mention the Poitevin area to my friends.
|
|
|
Post by htmb on Jan 20, 2014 23:47:37 GMT
It looks like La Rochelle will be our home base for the week. We all agree we are looking for somewhere where we can slow down the pace at times, but there's still plenty to do and see when we want to go for excursions. We will be gone from there well before the film festival, and my friends know the area quite well, having stayed for extended periods at least twice before.
I think in my very first AnyPort post I mentioned the fact that I was adopted as an infant and that I've only recently been able to trace my ancestry to the La Rochelle area through my French Huguenot ancestors. I've always wanted to visit the area, so I am pleased with the selection.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 21, 2014 6:47:32 GMT
La Rochelle is a great city.
|
|
|
Post by mossie on Jan 21, 2014 14:58:00 GMT
Have a great time exploring htmb, it is always special to go back to a place once inhabited by your ancestors.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 21, 2014 19:17:29 GMT
When I go to Lorraine, although I would never want to live there, I see all sorts of physical characteristics in the people that make me know that it is my "genetic" area. It will be interesting to see if you feel the same thing when you go there. ("Genetic" areas can be bigger than one expects, because I have seen the same identifying marks in Saarbrücken and Luxembourg -- and yet not in Nancy.)
|
|
|
Post by lagatta on Jan 21, 2014 22:07:18 GMT
I've never been to La Rochelle, though it is a place that should have the "genetic markers" for Québec. I have friends in Clermont, so have a somewhat sunnier view of it, though I admit it wouldn't be a destination of choice otherwise, interesting as the volcano area is.
|
|
|
Post by htmb on Jan 21, 2014 22:35:57 GMT
Yes, Kerouac, I remember you saying that about similar features in the Lorraine. It will be interesting to see what I observe in the La Rochelle area. My ancestors along that line were Huguenots who went to Staten Island by way of London. Then later moved to New Brunswick, followed by a move to Maine. All this happened over the course of about 350 years, of course.
|
|
|
Post by htmb on Jan 22, 2014 2:38:50 GMT
My friend is originally from Clermont. She will be continuing on to see family after our La Rochelle week. It's an area I'd like to eventually visit, but La Rochelle will work out better for us as a group since it will be our first week in what I am sure will be a much needed vacation.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2014 22:27:23 GMT
Clermont itself is not of great interest, but the road from west to east to get there through the Massif Central is really nice. You have probably seen my reports about a small bit of that area -- 'Auvergne take 1' and 'Auvergne take 2' for example.
And since things change, I would also like to recommend my Marseille report to tetsyd, to show that a 'seedy' city need not always remain the same.
|
|
|
Post by htmb on Jan 22, 2014 22:38:03 GMT
Interesting information, tetsyd. Thanks! I have seen all Kerouac's reports mentioned, but those reports are fabulous and certainly worth mulling over, especially for the fabulous photos.
I am sure I could go with my friends to Clermont, but I already have other plans. Plus, it would be very difficult for them because they only see family every couple of years and they'd want me to be comfortable, too.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 25, 2014 16:59:14 GMT
I was thinking more about the sort of driving trip that I would like to do if I were going through this region. I tend to cover more territory than most people because I know that I can always come back and see what I missed some other time, but I know that a lot of people don't feel that they have this option. Anyway, this is just a rough idea because www.viamichelin.com will choose the most basic itinerary from place to place unless you tweak your requirements mercilessly. Anyway, in terms of a starting point, the Tours TGV station (Saint Pierre des Corps) is an easy place to head west towards the coast, with plenty of things to see along the way (to be determined by careful study of detailed maps). You might really want to start in Nantes for reasons of time limitations, but if at all possible, following the Loire, which has roads on both sides of the river is a really lovely drive. After Nantes, I would imagine driving to the coast, where towns like Pornic and Les Sables d'Olonne (and a number of other places) could be good for overnight stops. And then La Rochelle is a magnificent place to stay for a day or two -- on the old port if possible. imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/607/ci21.jpgAfter La Rochelle, places like Oléron and Royan are other good seaside places with historic lighthouses, fishing ports, and all of that ocean stuff. If you head in the direction of Limoges after that, there are plenty of historical cities to take a look at. Angoulême is quite nice, for example. I ended my plotting at Limoges, which is a city that does not fascinate me, but if you are interested in the china manufacturers it is quite interesting. The very grim WW2 vestige of Oradour-sur-Glane is in the suburbs of Limoges, and the train station of Limoges is one of the most magnificent in France, which made me think of it as a good place to get a train back to Paris. An alternative could be Poitiers, which has the advantage of being on the TGV line. Just a few ideas that I thought I would sprinkle along your path... imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/838/49cr.jpg
|
|
|
Post by htmb on Jan 25, 2014 19:13:43 GMT
Ahhhhh. Wonderful information, Kerouac. Thank you for writing out these ideas and suggestions. Very helpful information indeed.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 25, 2014 22:06:38 GMT
After consultation with your friends, more possibilities can be suggested.
|
|
|
Post by htmb on Jan 25, 2014 22:23:50 GMT
Well, when one travels with friends you must also be flexible and tuned in to their needs, as well as your own. It does not look like we will be renting a car unless it's for a day trip. We will be taking the train directly from Paris to La Rochelle and renting an apartment there for the week. As mentioned before, my friends have stayed in La Rochelle a few times, most recently three years ago, and they were happy with walking and taking buses and bikes to more local areas. Since a week isn't very long anyway, I'm fine with that plan, too. It also looks like only my French friend will be going with me, since her husband has some other commitments to deal with back here. As always with him, we know he could change his mind as the last minute, but we are moving forward with our plans. Not being one of those travelers who think I need to see "everything at once" lest I never return again, I'm happy having a more relaxed week to plan around and, perhaps, I will return to the area again next year in my own and pursue some of your suggested routes, Kerouac.
The killer for me will be flying from the US to Paris and going straight to an early afternoon train from Gare Montparnasse to La Rochelle. My brain will be buzzing from the minimal sleep, I am sure.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 25, 2014 23:12:58 GMT
Well, at least everyone agrees that La Rochelle is a good place to stay. It is.
|
|
|
Post by htmb on Jan 25, 2014 23:14:58 GMT
I'm glad of that, to be sure! I have a 2009 Rick Steve's guidebook for France and it's not even mentioned, so that's a good thing.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 25, 2014 23:18:48 GMT
I will continue to stress the importance of being near the old port.
|
|
|
Post by htmb on Jan 25, 2014 23:24:15 GMT
Good to know. We started looking at apartments today. Near the old port has been my goal, but I wasn't sure if that was the good choice.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 26, 2014 11:15:32 GMT
And I would recommend renting a car for 3 days through www.autoeurope.com -- it will cost about the same as a one day rental done as a walk-in.
|
|
|
Post by tod2 on Jan 26, 2014 14:43:52 GMT
I'm pouring over all this information with you htmb! I don't know if Kerouac agrees, (but he is bound to know), if one is spending a night or two in La Rochelle you should make time to see the Ile de Re`. I bought some butter made there when I did shopping at Borough Market in London. The place fascinates me and I know it's a holiday destination which can get crowded. Kerouac has some great suggestions on that driving route ! Thanks for the car hire tip!
I have been to Tours twice - once arriving by train from Paris, and also driving there from Chartres. An off-shoot from there which I love is Azay-le-Rideau with it's chateau. Our walk through the Loire valley started from there and encompassed Saumur, Chinon and numerous chateux all the way to Angers.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 26, 2014 17:42:36 GMT
I have not yet fallen in love with Ré, but I know that it is because I have never spent more than a few hours there. What I have seen is "flat and boring" but it is just because I have been passing by instead of stopping and settling for awhile. I am in a very small minority in not having yet decided to like the Ile de Ré, because every single person I know loves it. So, since it is right next to La Rochelle, obviously it should be visited. No car would be necessary to go there because there is bus service from La Rochelle. Actually, there is one horrifying thing about the Ile de Ré in terms of its normal residents. Real estate there has become so outrageously expensive that absolutely anyone who owns a house there is automatically a millionaire. Since there is a tax on the rich in France, this means that quite a few very simple farmers who have lived there for generations are now obliged to pay the tax on the rich. Or else they can sell their land and move elsewhere, which just increases the property values in Ré and makes the problem even worse.
|
|