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Post by whatagain on May 31, 2020 16:08:30 GMT
Hi Mark. How did you know i am a lift operator ? A man who prefers german beer above belgian beer shows a total lack of taste.
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Post by onlyMark on May 31, 2020 16:33:08 GMT
At the risk of being sanctioned I'm afraid what comes across by you as hatred for a different nationality, due to other mentions in the past that you seem to think are 'humorous' or 'teasing' and also come across as condescending and bullying - and no, they aren't something I can 'prove', just memories that are over the line of reasonableness, I'd just like to say the following, just so you know where you stand with me as regards your numerous comments that have so far been left unchallenged and I think enough now is enough - sufficiently so that one member I know of left due to your attitude. One example is - "Avoid everything dutch. There is always a better alternative."
I think it's time you had a little of it back - Consider how evocative the names of many major European cities are, Berlin, Vienna, Paris, Marseilles, Barcelona, Lisbon, Amsterdam.... the thoughts and impressions people have, even from those who ever never been there..... and the first thing that springs to mind of the major city in Belgium, is a generally disliked vegetable. I had a look on Wikipedia for the page on famous Belgians. It was blank apart from stating, ‘Updates appreciated’ and a date of 1983. I did though delve deeper into the dusty areas frequented by websites like “The Roundabout Appreciation Society”, “Tarmac Colours – which is your favourite?”, “A list of numbers after the decimal point in Pi (incomplete)” and a forum on recording for posterity the amount of clicks you could get from the top of a ball point pen. It said the most well know Belgians were Jean-Claude van Damme and Kim Clijsters. Special mention was for a man called, Rudy Beckers who invented parking sensors. In looking further about the merits of Belgium I came across a study whereby geography students in European universities were asked to point to all the countries in Europe. It seems 97.23% couldn’t indicate where Belgium was. A Europe-wide census in 1991 listed the countries and gave an appendix of positive words to be associated with any country. The top most associated word for France was ‘food’, for Germany was ‘technical’ for Spain was ‘lifestyle’, for Portugal was ‘beaches’. For Belgium it was ‘chocolate’ at the top. In fact that word had to be as it was the only one anybody ever mentioned. Nobody could think of any others and many professed to not really liking it anyway and it was over-hyped. Blaise Pascal was a French mathematician and physicist amongst other things and in the 17th Century made great strides forward in the science of pressures. As such a unit measurement of pressure was named after him. It was determined that a standard atmosphere is 101325 Pascals (Pa) and this reduced as you got higher in elevation. He understood that at some point the pressure would theoretically drop to zero, thus becoming a vacuum. In his notes he always called this state “a Belgium”. Louis Theroux, well known for his human interest documentaries, was asked to do a programme about Belgians. He sent a team of researchers there who came back a month later and said there wasn’t anyone interesting. To paraphrase a wrongly attributed Winston Churchill quote, “An empty taxi arrived outside, and a Belgian got out.” If you live in a glass house...... Now we’ve got that out of the way, maybe time to move on and get back to the thread.
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Post by whatagain on May 31, 2020 16:45:36 GMT
You know Mark, i didnt choose to be Belgian. I could have been born 100 east west ir north and woukd have been durcb german or french. So thanks for your post but cant see your point. You dont like the way i post or what i post or you dont like me and so you denigrate a whole country ? I am disappointed. You can do much better.
Btw you didnt find a site that said Belgium was all about fries and that Charleroi, my native town, is the ugliest city in Europe ? You can really do better.
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Post by onlyMark on May 31, 2020 17:09:54 GMT
...but cant see your point. You dont like the way i post or what i post or you dont like me and so you denigrate a whole country ? Which is the response I would expect from someone who is completely blind to how they have denigrated a country, a peoples, a section of society over the years. They can't see they've done anything wrong. It never crosses there mind so when they are fronted up about it, the reply is always, "Who me? What did I do wrong?" I have nothing against the country or the people, I am against the denigration of others in the form of your comments. This time you say, "Avoid everything Dutch, There's always a better alternative" and then you can't make the connection to me commenting on Belgium? Get a grip sunbeam. You say bad things about a country (and not for the first time) and I say bad things about your country (for the first time, by the way). Yet you can't see the point? You I have have nothing personal about. Your attitudes I do. I welcome and enjoy your posts, I don't welcome and enjoy all of them though when you display that attitude. You can really do better. I will let you have the last word, a response and then we'll move on.
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Post by whatagain on May 31, 2020 18:41:03 GMT
I still dont see your point. You behave more stupidly and without the excuse of being humorous to make me understand i am stupid. Ok Why didnt you just say i am stupid ? And why did it take you so long to say so ? Why do you have to say belgians are worthless and belgium not worth of a footnote in a tourist guide ? Stay focused. I am the one being stupid. You dont need to insult my country to prove it. Now we dont even need to get along but we could agrée on one thing : we dont like each other. I didnt know you didnt like me. I take note of it. And i dont care. I am sorry it seems it kind of bothered you that you didnt like me and would not express it. I hope you feel better now that it is out of your chest. Wishing you the best.
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Post by onlyMark on Jun 1, 2020 20:36:27 GMT
Paristwat/whatagain - I notice you have made yet again a comment denigrating the Dutch. It is the first one below. Just dipping into the forum for a few minutes, here are examples seeing as you didn't "get the point". Maybe there are more, maybe not, but I think there are sufficient here to illustrate "the point", never mind what is written in the previous posts above. I don't dislike you, I have no real opinion of you, I'm neutral, to me you are just a characterless forum member - but with a bigotry that needs addressing. That is the thing I don't like - He is French... nobody is perfect (and at least he is not Dutch). Another reason to add to my dislike of the Dutch. Got a Dutch guy. Arrogant. All is my fault. It says it all : Dutch ... ability to buy ... Blowing air, if you ask me, something the Dutch have always been good at. Would not happen in civilized country, like Belgium. Oops my neighbour who is 57 is a young father of a 6 months old, borne by his new girlefriend of about 23, younger than 2 of his children. Actually his wife is older than me but quite attractive. Yes, but now comes the truth : the neighbour in question has worked several years in Amsterdam (where he found his new girl) - must have been infected. worse still Heineken : Dutch piss. Bah. Makes now 188 years that we kicked out the bloody dutchs. Another reason for us Belgians to dislike the Dutch. lot of businessmen talk over the phone. Loudly if they are Dutch Never trust anybody with a Dutch flag Netherlands have no real culture for food. Seems they eat to live, whilst we live more to eat... And we didn't even talk about that liquid they try to make psas for beer, called Heineken. Anybody who has tasted Belgian beer understands what I mean (me chauvinist ?). Did I say that we freed ourselves from their tyrrany in 1830 ? Dutchland is the country of mills. Mills brass a lot of air and catch it as high as they can. So will do the Dutchs. When we want to be rude we call the Dutch 'kaaskop' which means 'cheese head' with head for the animals ('hoofd' should be used if we wanted to say Dutchs were human). Signed : the Belgian. We kicked out the Dutch in 1830 and feel good since.
Is this the underlying reason for your animosity? -
People who didn't intervene were Dutch, they just looked at us Belgians being slaughtered and stayed neutral. But yes, I don't like this side of my neighbours ;-) Do you get the point yet? Rein in your bias. It's not big and it's not funny.
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Post by bixaorellana on Jun 1, 2020 21:10:56 GMT
I know I am going to be ignored here, nevertheless ~ This is getting personal to the point that bad feelings are going to remain if it can't somehow be resolved or brought to a halt now. There are many treasured members here whose prejudices can peek out at times -- and no, I am not going to list examples. Suffice to say that sometimes those prejudices are aired in a self-mocking way that may not be perceived as joking by others. We're stuck with the written word here, so intonations, facial expressions, and other cues are lost. If the original comment meant as joking or sarcasm is not taken that way, it can cause either silent resentment/dislike or a written, sometimes harsh rebuttal. Either way, that can negatively escalate either immediately or at sometime in the future. And yes, sometimes things are said deliberately to provoke, either bluntly or slyly, at which time the chips will fall where they may. We have to remember we're all here from different countries and passions, fair & unfair, can run high even decades after whatever conflict inflamed those passions. Not saying that is okay, simply that it's a fact. Anyway, I hope the two men currently involved in this back and forth might decide to step back and realize that since they don't know each other in real life, some of the negative feelings might be caused by how the other person comes across online.
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Post by whatagain on Jun 1, 2020 21:32:17 GMT
Mark.
You did spend all that time finding that than copied pasted it to prove your point ? What point ? That i dont seem to like the Dutch ? And you took all that at face value. Mate you have a problem. What comes next ? You call interpol to avoid me from going to Amsterdam and kill anything that speaks Dutch ? They might tell you half of Belgians say the same, you know that ? Get a life and give me a break. This is my last message to you. Just ignore me, for the sake of the others on this forum.
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Post by onlyMark on Jun 1, 2020 21:41:30 GMT
We have all been guilty of saying the wrong thing on a subject but generally this happens only once or twice at the most before we learn from it as it is picked up on and commented on very soon. In this instance I have seen these comments over a very long time and the theme never changes nor is modified, not do I believe they are humorous even though they may be appear to be couched at times in that framework.
I believe the feeling behind them is deadly serious and must be, due to the sheer number and frequency of them, especially as upon being challenged about them, the next one comes in short order - and no, that one isn't a piss take from what had gone before - it is a deliberate provocative act - never mind the more mild reference in brackets to emphasise the point even more that it was 'Belgian cheese' - that I felt was not necessary to comment upon, but it was deliberately put there as a snub to what had gone before - as though to say you can't stop me saying these things.
Nope, I've not said anything before, but it has now gone on far too long, never mind the audacity of having it pointed out and then doing it again virtually straight away.
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Post by onlyMark on Jun 1, 2020 21:59:29 GMT
"You did spend all that time finding that than copied pasted it to prove your point ? What point ?" It was worth the minimal effort I put into it to give you a chance again to see the point. The search feature is good and quick. You said twice you didn't get what the point was. I was giving you a last chance to do so. I now know you do see the point but are determined to ignore it and feel the victim that you haven't done anything wrong.
"That i dont seem to like the Dutch ? And you took all that at face value." There is no "seem" about it. You dislike them intensely. You only need to read you comments to see the truth in that. Face value - there's no other way to take them. They are unsubtle an express a basic emotion.
"What comes next ? You call interpol to avoid me from going to Amsterdam and kill anything that speaks Dutch ?" You make an exaggeration like that to convey the impression my comments are exaggerated because in your mind they must be as you are convinced you have said nothing wrong.
"They might tell you half of Belgians say the same, you know that ?" Ahh, sorry, that's ok then. No problem, I'm sure your comments should be deemed to be acceptable because so many people feel the same way.
"Get a life and give me a break." My life is of no concern to you and I have been giving you a break for a long, long time, otherwise I would have pulled you up about this long ago. You have had enough breaks over the years, yet you feel you should be allowed more?
"This is my last message to you." I doubt it, the same as I doubt you can stop denigrating the Dutch.
"Just ignore me,....." I have no problem with that at all - unless and until you keep making comments that have such obvious bias. Stop doing it and you'll never hear from me again.
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Post by kerouac2 on Jun 1, 2020 22:13:47 GMT
This just looks like an alpha male situation to me. Makes me relieved to be a beta.
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Post by onlyMark on Jun 1, 2020 22:50:23 GMT
Missed the other comments on the other thread, this one is of interest where you say -
"Mick. That is called provocation." And yet you still seem unaware of your own provocative opinions on the Dutch. Your appear blind to them and believe them to be innocuous and acceptable.
"But Mark missed the part about French being already lower on the scale." I take that as a non-serious comment.
"Bixa. Yes just between 2 people. I am like i am and i dont need to be lectured by strangers." Then who will point out your failings? Especially if your friends hold the same opinion, then you'll never be told.
"I am like i am" That is always the defence and default position of those who feel their bad behaviour and/or character need not be altered and see little wrong in it. "It's just me." or "That's what I'm like."
"Mark. You have nothing better to do than telling me what i should do think or write ?" I have had better things to do for a long time but eventually your continual and frequently commented bias has worked its way up to a level of importance where it has become unacceptable and thus needs speaking about. I care little what you think, I care about when you so frequently express that thought in writing and even more so that when it is pointed out to you, you continue to do so and feel that as half the population of Belgium think the same way, according to you, that thought is normal, reasonable and rational.
As for missing points, you missed where I said that you make good posts and are interesting and I look forward to you continuing to do so but I add that the anti-Dutch sentiment should disappear. Think what you want, but writing that vitriol for all to see is a different matter.
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Post by onlyMark on Jun 2, 2020 15:44:31 GMT
Yes. Civilised people got theif gifts at St Nicolas. Belgians. Germans. Asatians. Moselle and lorraine ? Spaniards too i think or only Catalonia ? And strangely... the Dutch. The previous generation got an orange... "Civilised people got theif gifts at St Nicolas"......... "And strangely... the Dutch." Relentless, aren't you? Day after day after day. After what has gone before, what has been said before? Yesterday and the day before. I told you about it two days ago, you repeated your bias yesterday, so you were told about it again, and you repeat it again today. You are now deliberately being provocative, taking the piss, "cocking a snook" and thinking we are all twats. What's your excuse this time? Felt it was quite an innocent joining of the words civilised and strangely the Dutch? It is a compulsion with you.
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Post by kerouac2 on Jun 2, 2020 16:01:51 GMT
I don't actually think that whatagain thinks that WE are all twats. It looks more like he thinks that YOu are a twat, and you keep taking the bait again and again.
I learned to ignore taunts at a very early age.
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Post by whatagain on Jun 2, 2020 16:07:55 GMT
You totally misread my intentions.
I see you embarked in a noble crusade against people writing unacceptable things about Dutch. I fully support this obsession of yours and am doing my best so that you can sharpen your skills to make you the best self appointed sheriff in town.
Who knows matbe you could also police other forums - maybe you already do - and become a hero of the anti anti-dutch comments.
Whatever hang on and dont let your guard down.
Nooit iets loslaten, vriend !
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Post by whatagain on Jun 2, 2020 16:10:49 GMT
I don't actually think that whatagain thinks that WE are all twats. It looks more like he thinks that YOu are a twat, and you keep taking the bait again and again. I learned to ignore taunts at a very early age. I certainly dont consider you a twat. Is twat an acceptable word for oxymoron ? I dont get all subtleties of English.
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Post by lagatta on Jun 2, 2020 16:13:57 GMT
Heineken is crap, like lots of near-tasteless beers produced by multinationals the world over. My friends in Amsterdam, including native Dutch, (Flemish) Belgians and people from many other places, don't touch it. Here is a very good organic brewery located in Amsterdam East not far from where I stayed when in that city: www.brouwerijhetij.nl/ Located at an actual windmill! There are historical/religious reasons why the food was better in Belgium than the Netherlands, namely Catholicism vs Calvinism. This applies less and less nowadays. And a couple of generations ago, few but the wealthy got much more than an orange for St. Nicolas Day, Christmas or New Year's - anywhere. Often other gifts were useful things such as clothing, sometimes hand-knit or sewn. Ethnic or national jokes can be funny once or twice but not over and over. As for the most INFAMOUS Belgian, that's easy: King Leopold II.
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Post by onlyMark on Jun 2, 2020 17:23:07 GMT
Ok, not a problem then. I shall studiously ignore all and every statement of that ilk that spouts forth from your mouth. Every day, over and over again. Like I previously did do for a very long time. No matter how tiresome and repetitive they become. No matter how when it is pointed out more than once, you continue like a compulsive recidivist. I can only live in hope that given time the frequency may diminish to an acceptable level and to a point where they do become humorous once more. I doubt it though.
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Post by whatagain on Jun 2, 2020 17:44:55 GMT
Great. We will call it a truce. We stay on our positions. Guns loaded as befits a sheriff but we dont fire no more.
Lagatta, what is incredible is that when I was at school nobody ever said a word against Leopold 2, who has his name on boulevards etc and was known as le roi batisseur. Nobody ever said his money was covered in blood. Now fortunately things changed but slowly. Recently a book mafe a big buzz and was called les mains coupees - severed hands. You had to bring back hands of blacks to orove you shot well . .
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