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Post by onlyMark on Dec 30, 2018 10:01:49 GMT
Just wondering, no more than that, but does 'a' understand any English? No reason why she should, just curiosity.
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Post by casimira on Dec 30, 2018 14:00:04 GMT
Backtracking a wee bit here to the discussion about children and imaginative play etc...
I caught part of a discussion on the radio that touched on this topic. The gentleman being interviewed quoted a study that had been conducted about children playing outside versus indulging in technological types of entertainment/play indoors.(TV, video games etc.)
The study strongly indicated that a large percentage of children he interviewed expressed a strong desire to be able to play out of doors but were not allowed because of their parents anxiety and concerns for their safety.
The study also cited that the higher percentage rate of childhood obesity is largely due to children being confined indoors much more in current times as compared to 30 or more years ago.
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Post by Kimby on Dec 30, 2018 14:07:44 GMT
Coulda predicted that, couldn’t we?
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Post by rikita on Dec 30, 2018 15:14:03 GMT
Just wondering, no more than that, but does 'a' understand any English? No reason why she should, just curiosity. no, just the numbers up to twelve and a few random words like "ice cream", "chocolate" or "friend" ... she is curious about it though and sometimes asks me for different words in english, though she usually doesn't remember them for long ...
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Post by lagatta on Dec 30, 2018 17:36:29 GMT
When will she be starting school or preschool?
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Post by rikita on Dec 31, 2018 0:19:50 GMT
When will she be starting school or preschool? in august - school, there is no preschool in that sense, here - the last year of daycare kids are considered "preschoolers", and in some daycars they do some actual preschool stuff then, but in hers, they don't do much (and what they do is more offers for all kids, and no one has to participate) ...
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Post by kerouac2 on Dec 31, 2018 4:44:53 GMT
When will she be starting school or preschool? in august - school, there is no preschool in that sense, here - the last year of daycare kids are considered "preschoolers", and in some daycars they do some actual preschool stuff then, but in hers, they don't do much (and what they do is more offers for all kids, and no one has to participate) ... As of 2019, school becomes obligatory starting at age 3 in France.
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Post by rikita on Dec 31, 2018 9:41:37 GMT
that's compulsory nursery attendance rather than actual school though, isn't it? they discussed it here sometimes too, to make the last year of nursery compulsory, mainly so children already speak some german before starting school ... i have mixed feelings about the idea - i think some children could benefit from going to nursery, and i suppose three is the age where they start to be more social, so might enjoy to have other similar age kids every day to play with - but at the same time they are still very small, and if it isn't necessary because of parent's work, then i think they shouldn't be there all day, a few hours are enough ... also, since some kids suffer a lot from separation anxiety, i think it should be approached very gently. and personally i prefer play based daycares, i don't think there is any need of formal learning for kids that small, six or seven is quite enough to start that ... and i wonder if compulsory means compulsory attendance all the time? i'd be quite annoyed at that, i am glad to still have a few months where i could decide to do something nice with a. on a week day, when places aren't crowded, it's so soon that we depend on school holidays for everything ...
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Post by mickthecactus on Dec 31, 2018 10:26:37 GMT
Sorry to go off topic briefly but my youngest grandson was just 4 when he had to attend full time school. It was way too early for him and he struggled for years.
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Post by questa on Dec 31, 2018 11:22:57 GMT
Here they start school at 5 or 6, but there is a move to make it later as research shows that boys are not mature enough until about 7 to sit quietly and co-operate with others. My first boy was just over 5 and in hindsight should have waited the extra year that is permitted. He fooled around, didn't listen to teachers, became class clown and was generally out of his depth with classwork all his schooling. It wasn't until he was working that he matured and studied properly.
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Post by patricklondon on Dec 31, 2018 11:53:13 GMT
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Post by lagatta on Dec 31, 2018 12:01:40 GMT
Perhaps we should start another thread about early childhood education? Or it could be part of a broader thread on education.
Happy New Year, questa, and yes, I know I'm an hour early as they are announcing NY in Auckland.
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Post by rikita on Dec 31, 2018 12:01:59 GMT
a. is going to be six in a couple of weeks, and i am glad she still has half a year until she starts school - intellectually, i think it wouldn't have been a problem for a while already, but the whole sitting still and doing what told thing still isn't that easy - and also, she has so many things she is doing and learning through her pretend play and playing "theatre" and making up stuff, and i think she is learning a lot of important things through that, too ...
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Post by rikita on Dec 31, 2018 12:02:48 GMT
good idea about the new thread ... and sorry for steering this one off topic ...
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Post by bjd on Dec 31, 2018 12:27:05 GMT
Just before the thread is sent elsewhere, it is indeed nursery school that has become complusory at 3. The kids don't actually have to sit and learn, it's mostly socializing, playing, drawing, and naps in the afternoon. Basically, learning to be in a social context rather than at home.
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Post by kerouac2 on Dec 31, 2018 13:28:26 GMT
And of course kids who want to start learning to read and things like that are full encouraged and assisted. Actually, children in France can even start school at age 2 if they are fully toilet trained. ("Accidents" are tolerated even with older children, but accidents must not be too frequent.)
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Post by lagatta on Dec 31, 2018 13:46:10 GMT
What were the motivations for early school (as opposed to daycare) in France? I believe that in Denmark there are specific provisions targeting immigrant communities, but this seems universal in France - obviously problems of socialisation and lack of skills are not restricted to immigrant communities.
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Post by kerouac2 on Dec 31, 2018 14:04:43 GMT
Not being in the education industry, I do not have a full grasp of all of the ramifications. However, I do know that one of the reasons is to enable mothers to re-enter the job market more easily.
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Post by bjd on Dec 31, 2018 14:30:12 GMT
When the current government set the age for compulsory school at 3 this past year, it was mentioned that children who started in the school system later had more problems adapting. I think they mentioned that 97% of French kids were already in nursery school. It sounded as though the other 3% were indeed in immigrant communities, but they didn't say this openly.
Of course, another motivation for parents is that nursery school is free, unlike day care.
Not many nursery schools take 2 year-olds. It depends on how many kids are already there. Or sometimes it's to keep a class open if the number has gone down, but parents are not encouraged to put such small kids in nursery school.
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Post by lagatta on Dec 31, 2018 14:36:18 GMT
Yes, I can see how school hours would making re-entering employment easier than daycare would for young mothers. Our highly-subsidised daycare - early-childhood-education has paid for itself via the number of young, usually educated women who have been able to reinntegrate the labour force. It is much harder for young parents outside Québec.
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Post by amboseli on Dec 31, 2018 22:39:29 GMT
As of 2019, school becomes obligatory starting at age 3 in France. That's what our Belgian government wants, too. Far too young, if you ask me. Now it's 5 years.
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Post by questa on Jan 1, 2019 3:32:20 GMT
My grandchildren went to Montessori schools from 18 months to start of kindergarten at 4 years. The latter is part of the school system but not compulsory. The 1st 6 months is called reception and is mainly to teach the littlies the norms of school life as well as ABC and 2+2.
Kindergartens often advise parents to let their child stay for another term or so if she is not mature enough for "Big School"
"Monti" is a specially set up system with a lot of emphasis of respect and encouragement. Each child greets his teacher and when he talks to her, she gives him full attention. When class is over the child goes to his teacher and shakes hands and thanks her for what he has learned that day. It is a non-government school and not cheap.
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Post by lagatta on Jan 1, 2019 4:42:28 GMT
There is a lot to admire about the Montessori system, but it is elitist in that it excludes many promising pupils due to a lack of money.
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Post by kerouac2 on Jan 1, 2019 5:13:21 GMT
Montessori costs about 400 euros a month in France when normal school is free.
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Post by questa on Jan 1, 2019 6:21:50 GMT
It is an old story. Do the parents work long hours to give the kids the best education they can, or do they spend more time with the kids and hope they get good creative teachers?
The editor of the major women's magazine here noticed her cleaning lady dressed well and drove a late model car. She asked why the cleaner felt she had to do this work as well, as her husband had a reasonably good job. The cleaner replied that all her earnings went into a special account to give her daughters a private school education.
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Post by rikita on Jan 3, 2019 0:14:04 GMT
i am confused now, what is the difference between nursery school and daycare?
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Post by questa on Jan 3, 2019 3:58:35 GMT
In Oz,Daycare is looking after kids from 6 weeks on in different age groupings while parents work. The emphasis is generally on playing, singing and doing art, books and storytime. "cooking", dress ups and kids learn social skills like sharing, taking turns Etc. Parents pay each term and there is Govt assistance.
Nursery School is called pre-school here.It has education emphasis and is in the Education Portfolio for funding. Parents still pay and are eligible for Govt help. The kids are encouraged to think for themselves, ask questions, write their name, Know the concept of "10" not just recite it. Still have a lot of play but it becomes more structured and they learn co-operation. Excursions to the Fire station, Zoo and a farm.
Sometimes kids will be doing 2 days daycare and 2 days preschool as ages overlap. By 4 years the children start kindergarten and after a year of learning go on to the Reception class of the local primary school
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Post by kerouac2 on Jan 3, 2019 4:53:48 GMT
In France, day care is "crèche" where you can leave babies for the day. Nursery school is "école maternelle" for children 3 years and up (and sometimes 2).
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Post by onlyMark on Jan 3, 2019 5:09:30 GMT
Questa, virtually in one paragraph you've mentioned Daycare, Nursery school, preschool, kindergarten and reception class. And that's all before the little horrors start school. No wonder it all sounds complicated.
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Post by kerouac2 on Jan 3, 2019 5:48:13 GMT
I am surprised that it is not all "free." Obviously, taxes pay for it in a lot of countries, but at least everybody participates in the funding, even people without children. It sounds like people with children in Australia are penalized.
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