Dinosaurs and dragons

[Deleted]

The dragon myth has stuck in the collective subconscious all over the world, and people have been depicting them in art for hundreds and hundreds of years.

Since cavemen did not live at the same time as dinosaurs (in spite of what Hollywood tricked a lot of us into believing in our youth), it is not a prehistoric fear that has been passed down to us. Perhaps it was the discovery of large dinosaur bones that started the ball rolling.

Anyway, more about dinosaurs and dragons.

[spindrift]

I have an affinity for dragons and unicorns

I'm pretty sure I've read of small dragons living either in China or, perhaps, in Sumatra?

[Deleted]

Well, there is always the komodo, but it doesn't really spit fire.

[spindrift]

I must have been thinking of the komodo.

Strangely ,when I stayed in Krakow I visited a dragon's cave near to the river and the castle. It seems that dragons were in Europe too.

[spindrift]

Dragons feature in Nepali and Tibetan art. I bought this painting from a young monk (10yrs old) in a monastery at Thame, Everest region, very close to the Tibetan border.

This dragon still waits to be put into a frame.

[bixaorellana]

Above is a photo of an oarfish, just one of the many candidates for the title "sea serpent".

There have been many books and articles theorizing that creatures such as the Loch Ness monster really exist. Supposedly Loch Ness and some other glacial lakes are too deep for even modern technology to sound, thus the creatures escape detection. It is true that supposedly sane witnesses have seen mythic animals repeatedly in the areas where they're supposed to lurk.
theshadowlands.net/serpent.htm

I attempted to take a picture of my dragon with Spindrift's dragons:


Here's a closeup of mine:

This was given to me many years ago by a dear friend. She got it from an elderly lady who'd bought it in China on her Grand Tour.

[spindrift]

That's a superb dragon, Bixa. I am trying to understand the Kanji in your picture. The symbol underneath and to the right means ' under'. The small square on the left could mean 'mouth' or 'entrance' (guchi in Japanese)... and the '-' above it might mean 'one'.

(But it's confusing because 5 small squares translate as 'I' or 'myself'...signifying that we have five senses that make up one person)....Great language isn't it?

[traveler63]

I found this thread while snooping around some of the older posts.

There is a show that is coming to Tucson this month I think and I thought when I saw the advertisements, that is was really interesting. So, I did an internet search and found it. Here it is;

www.dinosaurlive.com

[bixaorellana]

Wow -- I had a little trouble getting the site open, but just viewed the film. VERY realistic looking! Love the expressions on the kids' faces. Are you all planning to see it?

[traveler63]

I wish I could, but there are some conflicts, socially.

[bixaorellana]

By Associated Press Writer Mike Stark, Associated Press Writer – Tue Feb 23, 9:24 pm ET

SALT LAKE CITY – Fossils of a previously undiscovered species of dinosaur have been found in slabs of Utah sandstone that were so hard that explosives had to be used to free some of the remains, scientists said Tuesday. The bones found at Dinosaur National Monument belonged to a type of sauropod — long-necked plant-eaters that were said to be the largest animal ever to roam land.

The discovery included two complete skulls from other types of sauropods — an extremely rare find, scientists said.

complete story: news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100224/ap_on_re_us/us_dinosaur_discovery

[hwinpp]

The fundamental difference between 'western' and 'eastern' dragons is that western ones are malevolent while eastern ones are benevolent. Also, eastern dragons can't breathe fire and usually live in the sea

[rikita]

how similar were the "eastern" and "western" dragons anyway, before there was a stronger contact between the cultures and the pictures might get influenced by each other? like, are there any old pictures of what a dragon is supposed to look like in europe?

[Deleted]

It seems to me that the sea serpent style dragons look quite similar in both Eastern and Western representations, but of course the Western ones have always been evil as well, sinking ships or making them crash onto rocks, when they weren't tricking the boats into sailing off the edge of the flat Earth.

Does anybody know if there were any dragons in the Americas before those visitors arrived from the East?

[Kimby]

Crocodiles, like this one, and alligators don't count?

[myrt]

I was listening to a radio programme the other morning about the Diamond Sutra in the British Museum. The lady discussing it just casually dropped in to the conversation the fact that the Chinese dragons did exist and were not mythical creatures. So I did a bit of googling and found this:

www.valserrie.com/vs%20A_DidDragonsExist.htm

I can't see any reason why the notion that dragons are mere fantasy should really be so prevalent - there are many creatures we still have no more than a sketchy knowledge of - in the deep oceans, for example.

[Deleted]

Well, the mention of dragons in Inuit culture answers one of my questions.

As for breathing fire, I can think of an explanation much simpler than the one given. Dragons appear to have had pretty awful diets -- all of those nasty bones lying around in their caves. If they burped methane instead of merely farting it, I can imagine some amazing surprises when people threw torches at them and such.

[Kimby]

Another Florida "dragon", much more dangerous than his cousin in #14

[Deleted]

I just don't consider aquatic reptiles to be dragons. The name "komodo dragon" for that Indonesian lizard has always been a farce.

A dragon is BIG -- much taller than a man, no?

[hwinpp]

Well, any dragon who's smaller than me I won't take seriously.

[cheerypeabrain]

An interesting thread, I wouldn't have thought that it would be beyond the realms of possibility that fossils were being found long before the science of paleontology was founded. It wouldn't take a huge stretch of the imagination to interpret the shadows from ancient times as dragons and other giants..or even goblins and gremlins!

As for nowadays, new species are being found all the time (not as quickly as others are becoming lost) altho I would be surprised if we DID find yetis, bigfoot, dragons and the like...but it would be quite cool....

[gertie]

I was told recently the ancient tale in China was dragons were what the strongest male koi who swam all the way upstream became, thus the reason for the long whiskers being a homage to the humble koi. Prior to this, I always kind of assumed critters like kumodo dragons plus some exaggeration were the source of the whole dragons business. I mean, surely no manly huntsman wants to admit the bite from a measly, over-sized lizard is the cause of them loosing a limb, am I right? I figured the breathing fire story came from the stuff in the Komodo Dragon's bite causing burning pain. I've read recently that a lot is pointing to the various people of the world were more connected than previously thought. They keep finding items from far off areas in digs that shows somewhere there was some sort of exchange. I'd guess a good storyteller told a tall tale around a campfire at some oasis and told it so well, the story just got passed on.

[Deleted]

I would imagine that some of the European tales of dragons far predate any knowledge of the Komodo dragons of Indonesia. Since big lizards do have bones, if there were any in Europe, traces of such should have been found somewhere.

[bixaorellana]

Having the doo-doo scared out of you by one of these creatures, might lead to saying you saw a dragon.

Click the picture for video.

(hint: let video buffer for a minute or two before viewing)

[Deleted]

Can't quite imagine those cute critters breathing fire.

[bixaorellana]

Ha! I saw the trailer for How to Train Your Dragon today, and the dragon looks somewhat like that salamander, only not so warty.

[gertie]

I loved that movie, Bixa! My friends and I all want a dragon just like Toothless for our next pet. ;D

[Deleted]

The precision of Chinese depictions would tend to make one think that they were indeed drawn by eyewitnesses.

[tod2]

What a fantastic - what can I caLL IT? a carving, ceramic, ?? Well, its absolutely gorgeous!

What I see happening here are two dragons fighting over 'the dragons pearl'. So may Chinese depictions of dragons include a pearl. I brought back two red paper dragons from Singapore, each with a pearl in its mouth.