The 13 year old father

[Deleted]

Although the entire world is in an uproar about this dreadful event in the UK, it appears that it is because the father is so young and looks even younger.



There are a hell of a lot of 13 year old girls giving birth all over the world every year, and I never seem to hear an uproar about that.

Meanwhile, I have some vague memory of the youngest person who ever gave birth being.... a 6 year old Mexican girl. As I recall, her brother was the father. I think he was about 13 years old.

[bixaorellana]

Am I the only person who instantly thought of the movie "This is England" upon reading about this baby-faced dad?

[Aussielover]

It's sad, I think, because it happened in a Western country where we are all supposed to be educated and have advantages that other people in less advanced countries can only dream of. We have access to birth control, career and travel opportunities. No one can quite believe that children would throw away their future to have children at such a young age. What I get out of this is that there is a segment of the population who does NOT feel like they have much of a future and don't feel like anything is being thrown away. Somewhere along the line, we are failing to excite our children about the world and participating in it. It's sad wherever this happens - but I think we are most hard on ourselves when it happens in our back yard because, haven't we all sacrificed in some way so that younger generations have it better than we did? Apparently, we are deluded.

[Deleted]

The idea of this brings up so many debates.... the idea of parents not being present enough anymore to know what their children are doing (but haven't children always sneaked away to do things?), the thought of the failures of sex education (did these children get sufficient information and if so, why didn't they take it seriously?), pornography and declining mores (now that just about any children can get hold of a pornographic DVD or whatever, does this give them sick ideas of doing what they see?), or just -- why are children so much more 'advanced' than they used to be? Or are they really? Due to excellent nutruition in the West, puberty arrives MUCH earlier than in the past, long before children have had any exposure to meaningful information about what this means. Is it just time to rethink EVERYTHING about what we believe children should be told, and at what age?

[gringalais]

Unfortunately, I don't think these kids see any other options for their life, they are surrounded by people doing the same thing. I read the boy's sister had a baby very young, their parents probably started having kids young too.

My fiance sees this kind of thing at work all the time, women who are 20 or younger that have several kids by different men. The main difference is that there is little in terms of welfare/benefits here. They generally come into his office loooking for help at getting child support to live off of. Very few of them work. Again, they are surrounded by people doing the same thing, so it seems normal to them. Higher education is just a pipe dream for people in that sort of situation since public schools in lower-income areas are terrible (so it is likely they could not get accepted into a university) and there is not much in the way of financial aid. So having babies becomes a career for them.

The baby should really be put up for adoption for her own good. That seems to be the only way to break the cycle. If not, we will probably hear about this boy becoming a grandfather before he turns 30.

[tigronette]

Well this certainly isn't new, a lot of working class and poor areas in England have been like this forever (with four or five generations of women who became mothers ages 14-16). These paces are predominantly white and very isolated - even the ones in big cties. i'm obviously not saying that we should sit around and ignore this kind of thing but it's strange that they're gettng all up in arms about it like it's our society that's about to implode.

In the words of Billy Bragg (who's from an area qute cose to the boy's) in the erly 80s:

I was twenty one years when I wrote this song
I'm twenty two now, but I won't be for long
People ask when will you grow up to be a man
But all the girls I loved at school
are already pushing prams

[onlymark]

It was normal in times past for women to have children young. No matter what the class.
My Grandmother, half Italian, quarter Greek, quarter French of high class had her first child at fourteen.

[bixaorellana]

True, Mark, but don't you think the big difference between then and now would be support and acceptance?

In eras & cultures where the business of women was considered to be marriage and child rearing, a young woman would automatically have social acceptance, older women to offer practical and emotional support, and other young mothers as a peer group. The difference between having an army of great-aunts, mother-in-laws, sisters, etc. all willing to hold your baby, help you out, and keep you company, and being a modern unwed teen isolated in a city apartment is the difference between your life and that of a prisoner in solitary confinement.

[tillystar]

I don't know what to think on this, its a tough subject. I have lots of different thoughts - some conflicting with each other.

I do think though that the child should be adopted "for its own good" is outrageous. No child should be taken away from its parents unless there is abuse - why is age a good reason? Shall we stop fat people having children, ill people, people with dyslexia? Hey, why don't we just sterilise people that don't fit our image of perfect!

I had a conversation with a friend who is a breast feeding counsellor and believes that feeding until 6 is natural and should be encouraged. She is involved in a big debate about it here in the UK. Her point is that children are physically able to feed until 6 so they should be allowed to if they wish. In the same conversation she was telling me its disgusting that these children had children and didn't see my point that if breast feeding at 6 is to be encouraged because its physically possible, what is the difference with kids having children at 13?

I don't believe that personally, I think in both instances society has moved away from what is "naturally possible" and it isn't the norm or to be particularly encouraged. At the same time there are always going to be exceptions and it has always happened and it doesn't mean the whole fabric of our society is falling apart as some papers here would have you believe.

[Aussielover]

Apparently, there is now a media blackout on this story because the mother was having sex with six boys and there has been some doubt thrown out there in regards to Alfie's paternity.

Shameful world we live in.

[Deleted]

And here we thought that age group was spending all of their time playing video games and writing stupid blogs!

[tillystar]

Well, on the plus side at least they are getting some form of exercise.

[Aussielover]

tillystar, I'm afraid to admit that made me giggle.