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Post by Kimby on Jun 9, 2010 14:53:48 GMT
How are you supposed to pronounce Jag-wahr?
And there's no CON troversy here. Never HEARD it pronounced with 2nd syl-LA-ble accent. But I often hear inSURance pronounced INshurance, which I never heard growing up in the American midwest....
BTW, Midwestern accents are traditionally favored for news anchors (think Tom Brokaw). But Canadians are gradually gaining acceptance. Once they learn to insert articles in their speech (in THE hospital, went to THE university)...
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Post by onlymark on Jun 9, 2010 15:32:32 GMT
How are you supposed to pronounce Jag-wahr? Jag-u-a. Jag as in bag u as in you a as in 'a' jaguar.
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Post by lagatta on Jun 12, 2010 13:23:18 GMT
In hospital doesn't mean the same as in the hospital; likewise in (or at) university doesn't mean the same as in or at the university. In hospital means hospitalised; in the hospital means you could be working or visiting there.
Think of "in church" vs "in the church". If you are in church, mosque, synagogue or temple, you are worshipping (at least in theory, you could be pretending to while checking out what fellow congregants are wearing) but you could be in the church looking at the beautiful architecture and stained glass.
In prison vs in the prison!
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Post by spindrift on Jun 12, 2010 14:59:44 GMT
Jag-you-are In-SHURE-anse
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Post by bixaorellana on Jun 12, 2010 16:26:49 GMT
But Canadians are gradually gaining acceptance [as news anchors in the US]. Once they learn to insert articles in their speech (in THE hospital, went to THE university)... In hospital doesn't mean the same as in the hospital; likewise in (or at) university doesn't mean the same as in or at the university. In hospital means hospitalised; in the hospital means you could be working or visiting there. Yes, but in the US one would say "at the hospital" to indicate working or visting there, same for in prison for incarcerated and at the prison for visiting or working. "At church" would generally indicate someone attending a service, whereas "at the church" would just indicate where a person or thing was. And "jag-you-are" ~~ !!! You Brits are famously wrong about that ua sound from Spanish, although in jaguar, all English speakers are getting the j sound wrong, to the point that jaguar (jag-war) and jaguar (hahg-war) are two different words in English and Spanish. Besides jaguar, perhaps the most famous wrong ua in English is Byron's poem Don Juan. Canto 1, stanza 1:I want a hero, an uncommon want, When every year and month sends forth a [highlight=yellow]new one[/highlight], Till after cloying the gazettes with cant, The age discovers he is not the [highlight=yellow]true one[/highlight]. Of such as these I should not care to vaunt; I'll therefore take our ancient friend [highlight=yellow]Don Juan[/highlight]. We all have seen him in the pantomime, Sent to the devil somewhat ere his time.
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Post by imec on Jun 12, 2010 17:22:07 GMT
But Canadians are gradually gaining acceptance. "gradually"? Canadians in key roles as anchors, correspondents etc on U.S. networks have included Peter Jennings, Kevin Newman, Fiona Conway, Richard Gizbert, Sheila McVickar, Gillian Findlay, John Roberts, Mark Phillips, Bob McKeown, Keith Morrison, Morley Safer...
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Post by bixaorellana on Jun 12, 2010 18:20:15 GMT
Yes, true. This brings us back to the similarity of US & Canadian accents, as I usually don't know which newscasters are Canadian unless I'm told.
It's also true that some broadcasting heavyweights have had Southern US accents: Roger Mudd and Bill Moyers. among others.
In broadcasting, the most important thing is that the news person have a pleasant voice and speak clearly. There is really no reason for them all to have the same accent.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 12, 2010 20:25:20 GMT
I always recognized Peter Jennings' accent as Canadian from day one. I liked the way it was clipped rather than the usual midwest mildly nasal style.
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Post by lagatta on Jun 12, 2010 22:28:33 GMT
The problem with Jaguar in English (of any variety) - or even in French - is to what extent we should keep the original pronunciation when using it in a sentence in a different language.
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Post by fumobici on Jun 14, 2010 18:12:27 GMT
If original pronunciation can be kept without becoming difficult for people listening to understand I suppose it's fine, even if it may risk sounding like an affectation. I'm more of a utilitarian than any sort of purist when it comes to language. The purpose of language to me isn't primarily cultural or to exhibit pedantic knowledge, but rather communicative. Firstly and most crucially, it must be understood.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 14, 2010 18:31:54 GMT
My former Chinese colleague was always harping about the pronunciation of sushi. "Why do the French say 'sushi'? That's so stupid. The correct pronunciation is 'soo-see'." We never believed her anyway because after all she is Chinese and not Japanese.
But I always told her "We don't care how it is pronounced in Asia. Sushi is our French word for that."
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Post by Deleted on Jun 14, 2010 18:33:41 GMT
Oh, and I always wanted to slap my dead friend Donna every time she talked about spending time in the Netherlands and eating a lot of "howda" instead of "gouda."
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Post by spindrift on Jun 14, 2010 20:33:03 GMT
Sushi - definitely pronounced with a 'shi' at the end. There is no 'see' sound in Japanese.
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Post by spindrift on Jun 14, 2010 20:35:23 GMT
Bixa - Jaguar...I was thinking of the Jaguar motorcar. We could only pronounce it the way I wrote it above....anything else, in england, would be laughable.
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Post by Kimby on Jun 25, 2010 1:13:35 GMT
But Canadians are gradually gaining acceptance. "gradually"? Canadians in key roles as anchors, correspondents etc on U.S. networks have included Peter Jennings, Kevin Newman, Fiona Conway, Richard Gizbert, Sheila McVickar, Gillian Findlay, John Roberts, Mark Phillips, Bob McKeown, Keith Morrison, Morley Safer... Of your list, Imec, I'm only familiar with the ones I bolded. And I watch a fair amount of TV news... (Isn't Brian Williams Canadian, too?) And I forgot to put an emoticon after my comment about "gradually gaining acceptance". Sorry if I yanked your chain.
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Post by cristina on Jun 30, 2010 3:28:12 GMT
I have never heard jaguar pronounced with any more than 2 syllables in the US...until tonight. It seems that the Scottsdale Jaguar car dealership favors the 3 syllable version. Oh, Kimby, Brian Williams is an American (NY or NJ, I think). And btw, we were college classmates. I wished I'd known then what he would become.
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Post by fumobici on Jun 30, 2010 5:06:34 GMT
Jag-you-are dealer in Scottsdale? Posh nobs
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Post by Kimby on Jul 8, 2010 18:04:12 GMT
Brian Williams is an American (NY or NJ, I think). And btw, we were college classmates. I wished I'd known then what he would become. Guess I must be thinking of someone else, then.
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Post by fumobici on Jul 8, 2010 20:22:21 GMT
There's a CBC (or maybe CTV now) sportscaster named Brian Williams too.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 8, 2010 20:44:11 GMT
I am not smirking or feeling superior, but I am often somewhat horrified at how English speakers say things such as:
déjà-vu croissant crêpe Sacré Coeur Champs Elysées hors d'oeuvre etc.
I just wish that there were more 'official' misrpronunciatons such as Chartoosse for Chartreuse or Fountain-blue for Fontainebleau to make things more comprehensible.
Actually, I think that Spanish is even worse for English speakers.
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Post by Kimby on Jul 8, 2010 21:00:28 GMT
Nothing can be worse than French for English speakers!
Spanish has rules that are much easier to follow than French's rules (especially the one about not pronouncing the last one, two or 3 letters of many words...)
French seems too complex to be a romance language.
Most horribly mis-pronounced word, IMO, the Greek "gyros".
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Post by bixaorellana on Jul 8, 2010 22:37:25 GMT
Well, French speakers are doomed to continue being horrified. Except for Sacré Coeur and Champs Elysées, the others are now English words, to be found in any English language dictionary. I tested it here www.thefreedictionary.com/ , and it only recognizes déjà-vu if it's written as deja vu.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 9, 2010 12:20:52 GMT
Just pass the hore doovies.
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Post by Kimby on Jul 9, 2010 14:23:05 GMT
No, it's "horsey - douvers"
Around here we pronounce them "oar-durves" - is that even close?
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Post by bixaorellana on Jul 9, 2010 16:30:12 GMT
Yep, oar-durves.
I think English speakers who know the language from whence a now-English word came automatically adjust depending on which language they're using.
For instance, I say rowdeeoh in the US and rohDAYoh in Mexico. Ditto Muhdrid and Mahdthreed.
I don't know whether it was here or in a previous forum that Kerouac informed me that the Louisiana pronunciation of sauce piquant (sawss peeCAW) is not eggzackly real French.
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Post by Kimby on Jul 9, 2010 17:06:50 GMT
For instance, I say rowdeeoh in the US and rohDAYoh in Mexico. Isn't it funny that the city that mispronounces its name - Loss AN-jell-ous instead of Los AHN-hell-ace - actually got it right on their most glitzy shopping street RohDAYoh Drive? (And here I thought they were just being pretentious!)
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Post by Deleted on Jul 9, 2010 18:01:41 GMT
Nope, that's Beverly Hills that got it right, not Los Angeles.
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Post by dahuffy on Jul 9, 2010 21:13:49 GMT
I've never actually found what Deschamps says to be very funny at all. I could never really find the humour in it. It must be because I don't understand French. My sentiments exactly!
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Post by dahuffy on Jul 9, 2010 21:19:05 GMT
But Canadians are gradually gaining acceptance. "gradually"? Canadians in key roles as anchors, correspondents etc on U.S. networks have included Peter Jennings, Kevin Newman, Fiona Conway, Richard Gizbert, Sheila McVickar, Gillian Findlay, John Roberts, Mark Phillips, Bob McKeown, Keith Morrison, Morley Safer... I only know of the 1st and last people.
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Post by dahuffy on Jul 9, 2010 21:26:28 GMT
Most horribly mis-pronounced word, IMO, the Greek "gyros". It's pronounced "j-eye-row" here in Oklahoma. I say "yar-o"
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