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Post by Deleted on Dec 26, 2012 6:07:44 GMT
There is a petition with 60,000 signatures to get this CNN journalist deported from the country for opposing firearms.
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Post by bjd on Dec 26, 2012 8:59:13 GMT
Is it a coincidence that his name is Pratt?
I suppose most of those signatures are from Texas. It's is so ridiculous -- the journalist is not "attacking the Second Amendment" -- he is attacking the other guy's stupidity.
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Post by mich64 on Dec 26, 2012 16:42:30 GMT
I enjoy Piers Morgan, I think he shares his position with passion and realism. I am not surprised there is a petition to have him fired, the people signing that petition want to quiet the people trying to sound the alarm that changes are needed.
Christmas Eve, near Rochester NY, 4 volunteer firefighters were gunned down, 2 killed, by a man with reportedly at least 3 weapons, one being the same as used in the school assault. He set his house on fire and then sat and waited nearby for the firefighters to arrive so he could kill as many people as he could, according to a 3 page typed letter they found on him after wards.
I wonder what response the NRA will have to this? Armed firefighters?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 4, 2013 16:47:36 GMT
A grim scenario and occurrence Mich. I remember when my husband worked for EMS here in NOLA and they (the EMS) would have to wait for clearance from the NOPD to respond to a call which was would oft times take an inordinate amount of time. In the meantime, there was a rap song very popular at the time, called, 911 Is A Joke, and it made the situation especially dangerous because, while, they may have been spot on with their lyrics and sentiment, it made the situation even more difficult for people like my husband who were waiting in the wings to save lives. What was/is even more disturbing, and remains so, were/are people who claim(ed)to be suicidal or homicidal fraudulently, in order to garner some kind of attention. This I know of personally having worked a Mental Health Crisis Line and having to make a decision as to when the 'boy cried wolf' or were serious. In the meantime, people who do this are indeed in need of help, but, what to do in this type of situation is always a judgement call.
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Post by mich64 on Jan 4, 2013 23:06:54 GMT
My husband has been held off by Police a few times before being able to get to a scene as well and finds it really difficult, usually here it because of weather conditions. On a few occasions the Police have called them to turn their hoses on to divert or separate a few situations.
In a city near us they had a person who later was diagnosed with a mental illness that was setting houses up for firefighters to get hurt in when doing their searches. He would cut out pieces in floors and stairs then set the house on fire with the hope the firefighters would fall through floors. It took about a year to catch him.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 5, 2013 6:32:03 GMT
In the suburbs of Paris, there was a problem (apparently finished now) of setting garbage can and worse fires to draw the police and firemen to the scene. However, there was rarely gunfire -- it was mostly rock throwing or dropping large appliances off the roof of the building. To this day, when the authorities enter certain public housing projects, they always glance upwards to make sure nothing is about to come crashing down on their heads.
To get back to the subject of gun control, though, I thought it was interesting this week that Switzerland is examining its gun policies after a shooting that killed 3 people. Switzerland is one of the most peaceful countries in the world, but people possess a lot of guns, in part because most of the male population are military reservists and obliged to keep their weapons at home. Ammunition is kept at military installations, but clearly it is not difficult to obtain bullets elsewhere.
Since the Swiss army is highly unlikely to ever be called into action in the foreseeable, many Swiss are now questioning this policy of "armed neutrality."
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Post by nautiker on Jan 15, 2013 12:35:46 GMT
media over here tell NRA just launched a shooting-app, approved for 4yo and up...
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Post by bixaorellana on Jan 15, 2013 19:09:21 GMT
I read about that last night. It came on the heels of the NRA tut-tutting over how video games engender gun violenc. Apparently it doesn't have sound effects, which surely would make it less satisfying. But still .....
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Post by Deleted on Jan 15, 2013 19:38:21 GMT
NY State Governor Cuomo was able to push through new legislation regarding the restricted sale of assault weapons and some other key restrictions regarding the sale of any gun to a person(s) with a mental health issue background. Here's hoping other states will follow suit.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2013 14:24:42 GMT
President Obama is due to do a press conference today introducing new legislation for "gun control". Will the US Congress support his efforts? Highly doubtful I'm afraid....
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2013 15:32:56 GMT
What's ridiculous is if you ask some of these gun people "do you think there should be gun control?" they always answer "hell no" but if your next question is "do you think Al Qaeda members or escaped lunatics should be able to walk into a gun store and buy whatever they want?" they immediately say "hell no."
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Post by mich64 on Jan 16, 2013 17:43:59 GMT
Yesterday was the new target shooting Ap by the NRA that suggests use for children ages 4 and up. Today, there is a new TV advertisement put out by the NRA. They use the fact that the US President has his children protected with armed guards, and insinuates that he believes the rest of America's children are not as important.
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Post by bjd on Jan 16, 2013 17:53:56 GMT
I just saw the press conference on the news here.
In journalists' comments afterwards, it was mentioned that a lot of Democrats put their party's losses in Congressional seats in 1994 down the the passing of the assault weapons ban during the Clinton administration.
They also mentioned the general background checks as being fairly easily approvable but not the assault weapons ban. WTF? The mind boggles. How can anyone possibly justify the need for assault weapons and ammunition holders that can hold so many bullets in civilian life?
I don't even know if they are used so much in the army -- surely you can only spray bullets around, not shoot with any precision? (I'm willing to be told I'm wrong there.)
I add that if the Presiden't children are protected by secret service people it's because there are crazy people with weapons out there ready to kill the President.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2013 18:43:38 GMT
Here is the inadmissible NRA ad (short version).
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Post by nautiker on Mar 22, 2013 14:18:08 GMT
it's an older story, however I just caught up with it: www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2012/07/26/gun-enthusiast-prints-weapon_n_1705523.html?utm_hp_ref=uk&just_reloaded=1I understand that the report was a bit of a hype and that it's still a long way -if at all- until it will be possible to 'print' your own assault rifle at home due to technical specifications, requirements etc., yet I'm wondering whether that day will come sooner or later (or perhaps there will be an increase in demand of just the essential 'spare parts', the other bits being DIY...).
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Post by Deleted on Mar 22, 2013 20:31:41 GMT
The main thing on which to focus is that places like New York which passed very rigorous gun control laws saw the crime/death rate drop dramatically while free-for-all places are still hving lots of people kill each other. It is so simple, I don't understand why this 2nd amendment stuff is such a problem.
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Post by patricklondon on Mar 23, 2013 8:54:46 GMT
Two things I don't understand about the American debate:
1. Since the Second Amendment says "A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State" - how come it's so impermissible to attempt to regulate the militia accordingly?
2. If the right of individuals to bear arms is essential to protect themselves against murderously dictatorial government, doesn't that mean there's something profoundly wrong with the entire constitution, that it could permit such a situation to arise in the first place?
You would still need explosives to make bullets, which is why controlling the sale of those is an equally important factor.
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Post by bjd on Mar 23, 2013 13:29:42 GMT
Reading the Second Amendment in Patrick's post just above, I am surprised that the States abolished military conscription. You would think they would consider it necessary to the security of the state.
I also can't see why the constitution can't be changed. It certainly seems reasonable to update a document written over 200 years ago under totally different circumstances.
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Post by Kimby on Mar 23, 2013 14:52:47 GMT
Conscription (the draft, as we call it) was ended because it was unpopular and because legislators children were not exempt. The "all-volunteer army" consists of mostly young men & women with few other prospects plus a few patriots from proud military families.
Re: amending the constitution, it is nearly impossible now as supermajorities are called for and the country is so polarized that even a simple majority would be hard to find. The Equal Rights Act for women made it most of the way through the process and died for lack of ONE state's ratification vote. I think. It's been so long the details grow fuzzy.
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Post by htmb on Mar 23, 2013 15:55:47 GMT
Well stated, Kimby.
I'm not sure if it's true now, but at least for awhile after the "draft" was ended young men turning 18 were required to fill out a form at the post office. The idea was for the government to have names and addresses on the ready in case the draft needed to be quickly reinstated. I remember my sons filling out the form when they turned 18.
This country is indeed very polarized. There is a lot of major paranoia among some groups. Two people I know are in the process of getting their concealed weapons permits. I don't get it. I will be more afraid of them accidentally shooting me now, than providing me with any protection.
This past week a student at the University of Central Florida, who was planning to kill as many of his dorm mates as possible, ended up killing himself when his plan went awry. Of course, it is not legal to possess guns on a university campus, but this former student, who the university was in the process of evicting, had several weapons and the makings for explosives. He pulled the fire alarm and had planned to shoot students as they fled the building. He apparently panicked and killed himself instead.
I don't get it. I don't understand why we continue to make it easy to purchase weapons and ammunition, and I also don't understand why seemingly law abiding citizens feel the need to arm themselves. Their lack of experience handling a gun is even more alarming.
I grew up in a hunting family. My father and uncles hunted for the sport and comaraderie, but they also ate everything they killed. It was part of the culture. I learned how to respect and safely use a gun and I was a good shot when it came to shooting skeet. However, I never aimed at, or killed, an animal. I also worked in law enforcement for awhile where I saw many of the crazy things people do with guns. Like others here, I have been touched by the deaths of family members and friends killed by guns. Most deaths were accidental, but a few were not. I don't own a gun and did not raise my children with guns. It's a different day and age from when I was a child and I see no practical reason for the average citizen to own a gun.
As Kimby says, we are a very polarized country. I am not optimistic about positive gun control measures being put into place. While it's seemingly easy to look at this country from the outside and wonder why something just doesn't get changed, keep in mind that there are many here who just do not want change.
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Post by mossie on Mar 23, 2013 19:11:30 GMT
With my tongue firmly in my cheek, may I suggest it is a clever form of population control. I'm running for my coat
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Post by Deleted on Mar 23, 2013 19:24:41 GMT
I regret the fact that when I was clearing out my parents' house and putting what I could into storage, I saved my father's pistol and ammunition. I put it in one of the boxes that my brother later went to pick up. While I know that my brother will not do anything dangerous with it, I should have just disposed of it permanently by throwing it to the alligators or something. All right, it would have caused a little pollution, but at least it would have been taken out of circulation forever.
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Post by htmb on Mar 23, 2013 20:07:36 GMT
It took my father three days to die. While he was in the hospital, in an irreversible vegetative state, someone tried to break into his home which was located in an isolated area. We assumed they were after his hunting rifles, which had been stolen, and recovered, many years earlier. My brother, with my blessing, took all my father's guns to his home. I have no idea what he did with them in the interim, but my sister in-law says she sold them a few years after my brother died. From what I remember, these were basically "one shot and load again" type guns. Certainly nothing along the line of an assault/automatic type weapon. It used to be we were worried about small handguns called "Saturday night specials." Now we've got young people with access to assault weapons. It's nuts!
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Post by Kimby on Mar 23, 2013 23:17:46 GMT
I believe young Americans still have to register with the Selective Service when they turn 18. And you can be denied student loans and other government benefits if you fail to register.
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Post by nautiker on Mar 29, 2013 17:07:41 GMT
seems the momentum is wasted: www.cbsnews.com/8301-250_162-57576248/poll-support-for-stricter-gun-control-wanes/interesting to read all your gun/family stories: after hard thinking I can name only two people I know who own guns: a good friend of my father (air rifle, at least he used to have one decades ago, don't know about today - and does that count at all?) and the companion of an ex-colleague of my wife (hobby hunter, never saw any of his rifles, though). all others: either no guns or extremely secretive about it...
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Post by htmb on Mar 29, 2013 22:38:29 GMT
Well, nautiker, I suppose I have lots more stories, so will add a few from time to time.
My father was a farmer. For many farmers and ranchers in the United States owning guns is a part of life. When I was growing up, half the time you would find a shotgun or rifle under the seat of my father's car or in the trunk. He used a gun to kill snakes, as protection from wild dogs, and sometimes he hunted wild game to eat. Occasionally, when he would hear "poachers" out on the farm property at night, dad would open the back door, yell "Get the hell out of here!" and then fire two warning shots into the air. Bizarre sounding, I know, but that's how my dad lived " back in the day."
I grew up being taught that "all guns are loaded," and to "never point a gun at anyone or anything unless you are planning to use it." Not even a toy gun. My brother, sister and I knew never to touch the hunting guns my father had leaning up in the corner of our living room. We were well trained, however, the flaw in my father's thinking was clear to me when my little brother entertained friends who were in awe of the guns and wanted to pick them up for examination.
As a young parent, with a then aging, a bit paranoid, and physically unhealthy father, I learned to scour the house and put away all weapons and medications first thing on arrival at my parents' home for a visit. I also taught my children never to touch a gun and to let me or their father know immediately if one was spotted. At my request, my parents finally purchased a locked gun case where they could store dad's guns, but he still kept a loaded pistol on top of the china cabinet out of my children's reach and out of my sight (or so he thought).
To this day, my now adult children have a tremendous respect for guns. They understand they are dangerous, but are even more so in the hands of someone untrained or in the hands of a child. They are passing the lessons I taught them on to their own children.
Of the two hundred or so adults I work with, I would be surprised if more than ten own guns. Of those ten, most would have guns because they hunt, while a couple of bozos would have them for personal protection. It's the personal protection, inexperienced users that concern me most. In my opinion, they're the ones who are most likely to accidently hurt themselves or others, or whose weapon would be taken and used against them by some would be attacker.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 30, 2013 12:40:33 GMT
France is still a traditional hunting country, so all rural people know all there is to know about gun safety. City people are still really stupid, though, and they are often shooting themselves or somebody else ("accidentally on purpose" some of the time). Naturally, in the poor housing projects, the same teens as in the U.S. have gun problems, too. Probably they should outlaw videos of Scarface, their #1 cult movie.
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Post by htmb on Mar 31, 2013 2:25:55 GMT
Once, when I was 19, I was staying in my parents' home alone while they were out of town and I was on summer break from college. I accidentally locked all my keys in the house and had to break a window pane in the kitchen to get back in, arranging to have someone come fix the window the next day.
Because the house was in the middle of nowhere, and because it had recently been broken into by an unknown intruder, I decided to sleep in my parents' bedroom which would give me access to a quick getaway (my bedroom was on a second floor, but theirs was built more into the side of a hill).
I took a pistol my father had left, loaded it, and put it on the bedside table before going to bed. I don't know how long I stayed awake thinking about a) the possibility of someone coming through the door, and b) the big old pistol on the bedside table.
I finally decided I was more afraid of the pistol than an intruder and would probably jump out the window if I heard someone breaking in anyway. I unloaded the pistol, put it and the ammunition on opposite sides of the room from each other, and went to sleep.
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Post by nautiker on Apr 1, 2013 11:53:49 GMT
thanks for sharing your stories, htmb – and though I trust the majority of gun owners nowadays act as responsibly concerning arms like you and your family do, this way of living remains strange to me…
what I often consider blanked out during the discussion is the historical background: it’s not that ‘we’ (in this specific case the Germans, however to some scale all of central Europeans) have arrived to a moral conclusion to severely limit private firearms on grounds of a superior maturity compared to the Americans, no, we just never had any in the first place to become addicted to: once guns could be manufactured in quantity, there was neither a specific need for individuals to have them (no ‘indigenes’ to fight, no dangerous wildlife anymore, no vast spaces with limited public order), nor did the aristocracy/the big land owners deem it a bright idea to make arms accessible to the proletariat/the simple farmers, i.e. it has all been rather controlled from the very beginning. further, both after WWI and WWII it was attempted to withdraw as many arms from civilians as possible – and though there is still a strong tradition of rifle clubs today, it’s rather customs than gun freaks you’ll find there. (not too sure about the majority of farmers here hunting, too, since getting the licence is not that easy - only those with a real interest will bother.)
So, the monopoly of arms has always been on the side of the authorities, and since we’ve fared rather well with this approach, there fortunately has never been a need to question this decision – it’s therefore easy just to lie back and point the finger at those who’ve grown up with arms and have become accustomed to them over generations. I guess we need to realise more that this is a very slow process for a nation and that is only marginally speeded up by those killing sprees...
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Post by Deleted on Apr 1, 2013 12:40:51 GMT
Unfortunately, it's not just guns in that "mentality." On Trip Advisor today, an American was asking if it was legal to break the arm of someone attempting to pickpocket you.
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