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Post by tod2 on Nov 22, 2014 5:32:46 GMT
Beautiful Bixa - I am in full agreement with Fumobici about the photogenic qualities of this place. You did us proud with some wonderful shots of old windows, sunlight and shadows, and interior pics were terrific - love that gee-gee!
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Post by bixaorellana on Nov 22, 2014 17:11:51 GMT
Huge thanks to all of you who took the time to look and to comment. I am absolutely basking in all your kind words. Interesting remark about Tuscany, Fumobici. Despite knowing that it's often the Tuscan countryside we're seeing in the backgrounds of Renaissance madonnas, saints, classical gods, etc., I always picture Tuscany as more craggy. Tod, I have to ask ~~ what's a gee-gee?
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Post by bjd on Nov 22, 2014 19:26:09 GMT
I don't know whether you are photoshopping your pictures for contrast, Bixa, but the colours are really wonderful, especially the sky over the red dome as you leave the monastery.
I also really liked the little chapel with the fairly plain (for Mexico) painted dark blue walls - it seemed much less overwhelming than the usual ornamented churches you show us.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 22, 2014 21:19:21 GMT
I am on the road and can't do justice to anybody's report at the moment. But I'll be back home tomorrow and should have time to look at everything and finally make a comment or two.
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Post by breeze on Nov 23, 2014 0:54:00 GMT
What a beautiful setting for this ex-monastery. So many jagged hills in the distance.
The building has fine proportions, possibly due to being roofless. Even when a church or cathedral has soaring ceilings, I often find the interior a little oppressive, so rooflessness is a plus for me. As a ruin, this place is free from its religious associations and I can appreciate it more.
Also, no crowds! I can enjoy photos of crowds of people but I don't want to put myself in the picture the way I do with this quiet scene.
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Post by bixaorellana on Nov 23, 2014 3:23:22 GMT
Bjd, the pictures in the slideshow had to be edited to bring out detail. But that set was taken in early afternoon on a very bright day in late October, 2012. All the other photos of the monastery benefited from the glorious late afternoon skies & light from our exceptionally rainy 2014 November. You are seeing what I saw. Hi Kerouac ~~ hope you're having a good time on the road! Breeze, you can probably tell by the number of photos how much I enjoy visiting that site. The wide empty space around it really adds to the feel of it standing there quietly crumbling through the centuries. Whoever was responsible for the outbuilding with the bathrooms did a brilliantly sensitive thing in sinking it so it's totally invisible from the grounds. You can see it from one point upstairs, but even so, it's hardly intrusive: I find the pictures around the arches in the downstairs gallery intriguing in their absence of any religious imagery. What was up with that?
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Post by tod2 on Nov 23, 2014 6:51:24 GMT
Tod, I have to ask :: what's a gee-gee? Bixa, we will really have to Anglo-size you more! Why dear heart, it's the same animal as those 'ponies'!!
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Post by bjd on Nov 23, 2014 7:03:34 GMT
Tod, I spent the first 25 years of my life in England and Canada and didn't know what a gee-gee is either.
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Post by tod2 on Nov 23, 2014 14:35:29 GMT
That makes me wonder where the term gee-gee for a horse came from I know it was a term used in my childhood by adults. In those them days adults talked baby-talk to children, as if the kid was unable to comprehend a 'real' word!
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Post by mossie on Nov 23, 2014 19:14:38 GMT
Gee-gees is also a term used to describe race horses, one "goes to the gee-gees". Could it come from the term "gee-up" originally used to set a horse in motion, but nowadays often when needing to galvanise some sort of action. Teenagers anyone?
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Post by tod2 on Nov 23, 2014 19:18:08 GMT
Yes you're right Mossie - I have definitely heard people say they're off to the gee-gees, meaning the Turf Club. I'm not so sure about gee-up - we use the term Giddy-up. But they're one and the same really.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 24, 2014 5:45:44 GMT
I finally caught up on this thread and had not yet seen any of the fantastic monastery photos because they were not showing up when I tried to check in. That place is really huge. What percentage would you say is still in use for the original purpose? I ask because in France there are lots of huge monasteries like that (and convents, too, of course) which were just about all closed during the revolution. Then some of them reopened in the second half of the 19th century, but I think that very few of them operated at more than 10% of their past glory. I am too ignorant of Mexican history to know if there was the same sort of purge during the revolution, but I suspect that there was since the "separation of church and state" laws in both countries are similar.
Going back to the beginning, that pottery shops has lots of fantastic items. I am generally impervious to that kind of stuff, but I'm pretty sure that I would have been leaning down to see the price tags on some of the items, but basically the items that can actually be used. Some of the purely artisic ones are fabulous, but since the upstairs and the downstairs maid walked out on me, I must absolutely refrain from any and all dustcatchers.
As always, your skies and landscapes are breathtaking and of course you never forget to give us those little botanical details that enrich these reports so much. The hibiscus is always one of my favourite flowers, because I like their simplicity as well as their impudent and fearless pistils.
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Post by bixaorellana on Nov 25, 2014 5:13:05 GMT
Kerouac, thank you for that very kind, sensitive, and even lyrical feedback. To answer your questions: First, about the percentage of the monastery still used for a religious purpose -- really, none except for that little church, which as far as I know is the only church in that little town. The Wikipedia article says: The decline of Cuilapan began in the 16th century, when the population fell from 43,000 in the 1520s to 7,000 in 1600. Construction of the massive basilica and monastery was halted by the 1570s, and was never finished. The Dominican friars were obliged to hand over the complex to regular clergy in the mid-18th century. From this point, the wealth and prestige of the institution declined. Church authorities neglected the maintenance of the complex, and it deteriorated until it was finally divested of its religious function by the 19th century. The complex has had several uses since that time, including that of a school, but its best-known function was that of the prison and execution place of Vicente Guerrero in 1831. As construction was begun in the 1550s, decline began fairly early on, since 20 years wouldn't be much to invest in the building of something that grand. The Wikipedia article rather airily refers to the complex being divested of its religious function "by the 19th century", completely sidestepping the fact that the 19th century was the setting for the Reform War. That brings us to your second question, about the purging, or at least hobbling of the church during the reforms which came about during the period after the first Mexican revolution of 1810 and official independence from Spain in 1821. In 1855 the liberal party inaugurated the period known as La Reforma:
The Reform laws sponsored by the puro (pure) wing of the Liberal Party curtailed the power of the Catholic Church and the military, while trying to create a modern civil society and capitalist economy based on the model of the United States. The Ley Juárez (Juárez Law) of 1855 declared all citizens equal before the law and severely restricted the privileges of the Catholic Church. source(Lots of luck trying to keep all this straight. Mexican revolutionary history rivals that of France in terms of trying to keep the players, factions, and side-changing straight. Here is an overview.) I know what you mean about the simple beauty of the utilitarian pottery. Whereas I'm able to avoid buying the ornamental stuff by envisioning yet more clutter in my house, the graceful curves of the bean pots call out to me, despite the fact that I cook beans in a pressure cooker. I don't think I've ever read a lovelier description of the hibiscus!
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Post by pinky on Jan 13, 2015 13:20:35 GMT
Hi Dott!
so great to see all these pictures and remember our lovely outing:) Your photographs are truly gorgeous! I miss mexico dearly and hope you are very well, and having a great time.
I send you my love, and fly big kisses to your beautiful pups!
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Post by bixaorellana on Jan 13, 2015 18:32:57 GMT
Pinky!!! Wonderful to hear from you & can't wait to see you again. Hope school & everything else is going well. You are going to have to take us around and give scientific insight on all the flora when you get back here.
I got some great pictures of you & A. channeling classic statuary. Your aunt said for me to go ahead & post them, but I won't do that without your permission.
Much love, big hugs, and wet smooches from the mutts.
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Post by cheerypeabrain on Jan 13, 2015 19:11:09 GMT
This thread is a real tonic...so full of glorious colour (stating the obvious here ) I absolutely love the pottery, really stunning and I would have had to buy lots of it. If I could just channel the vibrancy of your photographs into a painting I would be a very happy cheery. Splendid.
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Post by questa on Jan 13, 2015 23:07:25 GMT
I have just caught up with this thread. Bixa it is achingly beautiful. What you have done with the late afternoon light is marvellous. I agree with all the posters here about their favourites but can't choose any myself, my list would be a mile long. You are so lucky to live in such a colourful and vibrant culture, that monastery blew me away!
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Post by bixaorellana on Jan 18, 2015 2:53:43 GMT
Apologies & belated heartfelt thank-yous to Cheery & Questa. I really love how you both immerse yourselves in a thread and so kindly express yourselves. I look forward to the day you come see it all in person. Huge thanks also to my brilliant friend A. & her equally wonderful niece Pinky for permission to share the following pictures, which demonstrate that the apple does not fall far from the tree. Upon spying the empty plinths, both aunt & niece felt compelled to hop on them & channel classical statuary ~
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Post by questa on Jan 18, 2015 4:41:42 GMT
What fun, A. and Pinky must have a great sense of humour, and you too to video it and set music. thanks
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Post by lola on Jan 18, 2015 23:43:13 GMT
Darling.
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Post by bixaorellana on Jul 17, 2021 21:17:45 GMT
Reviving this old thread because I went back to Atzompa yesterday. We were hoping to see the ruins there and to maybe come across something really exceptional within all the traditional utilitarian and ornamental pottery items. It turned out that the ruins are closed because of the pandemic, but we did find some wonderful art in a new gallery opened by Fernando Peguero: www.facebook.com/Galería-de-Arte-Peguero-García-1856059608055893 The web pictures don't cover the range of his talent, plus show only older work. The gallery is a satellite of the larger one run by his mother, the renowned Leticia Blanco. I may be forced to go back to Atzompa, as there is a piece by Fernando calling my name. We started at the collective pottery market which is shown at the beginning of this thread, so I didn't bother with any pictures there. Afterward, we walked up and down the streets poking into the many pottery stores and workshops ~
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Post by mossie on Jul 18, 2021 6:56:57 GMT
A bit stupid of a doctor to have his surgery in a building labelled 'Kill Zone'
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Post by bixaorellana on Jul 18, 2021 18:51:25 GMT
Ha! I should have known you'd be the one to catch that, Mossie!
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Post by kerouac2 on Jul 18, 2021 18:53:26 GMT
Are those the only new photos you are going to show us?
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Post by bixaorellana on Jul 18, 2021 19:07:00 GMT
Okay, now for a real treat! As you all may remember, there were no cemetery pictures in 2020's Day of the Dead report. Thus, I know all of you have been clamoring, positively clamoring for my patented excess of graveyard shots. Imagine my joy when we approached a mini-mall of folkcraft and I spotted the cemetery just beyond. I quickly jettisoned my companion and made for the graveyard. If you all make it through the plethora of pictures, I'll be curious to know if anyone spots the one odd thing about this Oaxacan final resting place.
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Post by bixaorellana on Jul 18, 2021 19:23:20 GMT
Time for an important component of any trip to a village -- eating. This place was recommended by a lady at the afore-mentioned mini mall & we practically wanted to go back and kiss the hem of her garment after eating there. In a nice stroke of luck, we arrived just as the rains came ~ In my usual ladylike way, I opted for a regular bottle of beer. My companion was unable to resist the temptation of the house michelada. This was a whopping 800m. of beer, michelada seasonings, & cut up fruit ~ The huge grill out back obviously needs lots of wood to keep going ~ Nothing beats being snug and well fed under a palapa roof as the rain falls outside ~ The cow motif was strong. I suspect the owners' little kids were responsible for this line up in front of the bar. Yes, I did compulsively set them all upright after getting the picture. The bovine theme continues outside for a last look before going back to the big city. Adios, Atzompa!
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Post by kerouac2 on Jul 18, 2021 19:41:58 GMT
The first cow sign is absolutely wonderful. I want one!
I could provide a number of guesses about what is odd in the cemetery, but what struck me personally was the quantity of artifical flowers. Also there seems to be a surfeit of wrought iron crosses, but I would attribute that to a local artisan getting everyone's business.
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Post by fumobici on Jul 18, 2021 21:40:17 GMT
One? Seriously? You could do a Top 20 Oddest things list!
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Post by bixaorellana on Jul 19, 2021 17:07:30 GMT
Not really -- it's a pretty standard graveyard for around here.
The odd thing about this one, though, is how well-groomed it is, although of course there is a good bit of recent weed growth because of all the rain.
Typically, any cemetery around here, especially the more rural ones, looks entirely abandoned except for around the time of Days of the Dead. This bleak abandonment is initially shocking until you realize that of course "no one is home" except around the end of October & beginning of November. At that time, the cemetery will be covered with people sprucing up gravesites -- weeding furiously, mounding up graves, etc. As you can see in the Atzompa cemetery, that process seems to go on year round.
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Post by kerouac2 on Jul 19, 2021 21:30:31 GMT
The odd thing about this one, though, is how well-groomed it is, although of course there is a good bit of recent weed growth because of all the rain. That's not fair! Since all of us who visited appear to have been there for the Days of the Dead, we only saw cemeteries that were well groomed (actually better than the one in your photos). Now we're going to have to make return visits during the abandoned seasons to verify.
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