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Post by Deleted on Apr 21, 2017 16:43:12 GMT
I am just relieved that all of the recent terrorists have been French citizens and not immigrants. (Relieved in terms of the election rhetoric, not because I want French citizens to be terrorists.)
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Post by bjd on Apr 21, 2017 16:59:53 GMT
Yes, this guy was not on the S-list either, so le Pen can't send him anywhere.
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Post by lagatta on Apr 21, 2017 17:21:05 GMT
The killer was born in France - a violent criminal. He didn't attend mosque, drank and smoked... A common portrait of these guys.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 21, 2017 18:07:48 GMT
The policeman who was killed was a prominent member of the LGBT community, which probably adds even more poignancy to the event considering how fucked up politics are these days.
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Post by lagatta on Apr 21, 2017 18:54:42 GMT
Indeed, and it would take a lot of courage for a police officer to be a public LGBT activist, given police culture in even the most open societies...
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Post by Deleted on Apr 21, 2017 19:02:15 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Apr 21, 2017 19:40:37 GMT
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Post by questa on Apr 22, 2017 3:13:32 GMT
It seems that every generation has its psychopaths, thugs and killers for 'A Cause'. From the time of the Inquisition where the sadistic self appointed crazies had the authorities' support, through the days of the Jewish actions re Palestine and the IRA bombings. Now we have another bunch of thugs, more at home in a pub brawl but now with serious weaponry and too much testosterone. Why not round them all up and rent an island and put them all on it (wives and kids too).minimal care and attention, violence not followed up and no date of release This is the Oz way of dealing with refugees but I'm sure we could adapt it. Eh?
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Post by Deleted on Apr 25, 2017 10:38:54 GMT
The speech given by Xavier Jugelé's companion at the ceremony today was incredibly moving. I hope that it will be available with English subtitles.
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Post by bjd on Apr 25, 2017 10:43:17 GMT
Yes, I heard it on the radio. It must be so incredibly difficult to speak in front of a huge audience, to say things like that with little time for preparation because it is unexpected, and to remain outwardly calm.
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Post by bixaorellana on Apr 25, 2017 16:41:22 GMT
I watched parts of it and was quite moved despite not understanding French. His partner was visibly controlling himself, which made it all the sadder.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 25, 2017 19:15:39 GMT
I decided that I needed to translate his speech myself.
Xavier,
Thursday morning as usual, I went to work and you were still asleep. All day long, we texted, about our vacation plans, to a country so far away, to which you were so impatient to go since you had never travelled so far, the visa details, our preoccupations about accommodations. Our messages were a frenzy that was all the more joyful because we had just made reservations on Tuesday.
You went on duty at 2pm wearing your service uniform of which you took such good care since your appearance had to be irreproachable. You and your colleagues had received the mission to report to the police headquarters of the 8th arrondissement, where you, as was often the case, were supposed to maintain security for the public on the beautiful avenue of the Champs Elysées. You were stationed at 102 Champs Elysées, in front of the Turkish cultural centre. You liked this type of mission, I know. Because it was the Champs Elysées and the image of France. Because it was also culture that you were protecting.
At this place and at that moment, the worst thing happened, to you and to your comrades. The sort of event that everyone fears and hopes will never happen. You were swept away immediately, and I thank your lucky star for that. Your comrades were wounded, one seriously. They are recovering progressively to our relief. Everyone was in a state of shock.
I went home that night without you, with an extreme and profound grief which will fade away some day, I don’t know.
This grief gave me a feeling of being closer than ever to your colleagues who suffer in silence, just as you did. Like me, in silence.
As for me, I suffer without hate. I borrow the phrase from Antoine Leiris {whose wife was killed at the Bataclan} whose great wisdom in the face of tragedy filled me with such admiration that I read what he said several times a few months ago. It is a lesson of life that made me grow inside and which protects me today.
When the first messages appeared informing Parisians that a serious event was in progress on the Champs Elysées and that a policeman had lost his life, an inner voice told me that it was you and it brought to mind these generous and healing words: “You will not have my hate.” This hate, Xavier, I don’t have it because it’s not like you at all and resembles in no way that things that made your heart beat, nor any of the reasons that made you a gendarme and then a peace officer. Because the common good, service to others and the protection of all were part of your education and your convictions, and tolerance, dialogue and temperance were your greatest weapons. Because behind the policeman, there was the man, and you don’t become a gendarme or a policeman except by choice. The choice to help others, to protect society, to fight injustice. This noble mission, which the police and the gendarmes carry out, often with difficulty.
Before I even met you, I admired this mission already. The profession of police officer is the only profession mentioned in the Declaration of Human Rights. In article 12, it says “guaranteeing human rights requires a public force,” which is a very important detail at this politically important moment. “This force is instituted for the best interests of all and not for the personal benefit of those in charge.” We both shared this vision, but it is only one detail of who you were.
The other side of you was a man of culture and joy, for whom cinema and music were of prime importance. Five movies in a row on a magnificent sunny August afternoon was a challenge you were ready to embrace. And of course, you always preferred the original version as the purist that you were, and for the English language that you wanted to speak with perfection. You constantly went to concerts and even followed certain performers for their entire tour. Céline Dion was your star, but also Zazie, Madonna, Britney Spears and others. Theatre was a passion and a thrill for you. No cultural experience made you back away. You went to see the very worst movie on the day of its release and stayed to the end, no matter how bad it was. A life of joy and immense smiles where love and tolerance reigned supreme. You leave this star-filled life as a star.
I would like to tell all of your colleagues how close I feel to them. I would like to tell the police hierarchy that I saw sincerity in its eyes and humanity in its acts. I would like to tell all of those who fight against these events that I understand their guilt and their feeling of failure and that they must continue to fight for peace. I would like to tell everyone who showed their affection to me and to his parents that we were profoundly touched. I would like to tell your family that we are united. And to everyone who was so thoughtful to me, so thoughtful to us, that they are magnificently worthy of you.
To you, I would like to say that you will stay in my heart forever. I love you. May we all stay peaceful and dignified. And work for peace.
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Post by bixaorellana on Apr 25, 2017 19:19:55 GMT
Torrents of tears. That is absolutely exquisite. Thank you SO much for translating it, Kerouac.
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Post by lagatta on Apr 25, 2017 20:29:13 GMT
Yes, I wanted to, but didn't have time. (I've been translating a text about Indigenous cinema in different parts of the world). They were just playing long excerpts of Mr Cardiles' tribute to his late companion on the Radio-Canada afternoon broadcast.
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Post by questa on Apr 25, 2017 23:39:51 GMT
Thank you M. Kerouac2. I'm glad the translation was given to us non-French speakers by you. Your love and understanding of France shows in everything you write and your sensitive nature transmits the grief and courage of both men, both heroes.
M. Cardiles words should stand forever as a testament to the power of peace and love over hatred and wars. M. Jugeles death should be not be seen as a victim of war but a hero of peace.
Tears in eyes, lump in throat...again Thank you.
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Post by tod2 on Apr 26, 2017 6:53:10 GMT
Thank you Kerouac - not many could tell others that they bare no hatred for the despicable human forms that acted so callously. I know they will find peace in their hearts a lot sooner.
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Post by mich64 on Apr 27, 2017 1:03:31 GMT
Thank you Kerouac. Such a beautiful tribute of love, strength and admiration.
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Post by kerouac2 on May 31, 2017 12:37:28 GMT
Yesterday, Étienne Cardiles, who made the speech about his companion Xavier Jugelé, was married posthumously in the presence of former president Hollande and mayor Anne Hidalgo.
Naturally, this made me wonder about the conditions for such an event. It turns out that there are just two: death by a grave event (generally war or terror) and a clearly known matrimonial project or desire. This is submitted the Ministry of Justice and then to the president, who is the only person who can decide to authorise the marriage or not.
I wasn't able to find how many posthumous marriages have been performed, but I did learn that the current law in France dates from 1959 after a dam broke in the south of France, killing 423 people.
Reading more about the subject, it appears that France and Germany have been the two principal countries to perform posthumous marriages during the two major wars of the 20th century and generally to preserve the rights of unborn children. Other countries that have performed at least one posthumous marriage include the United States (1987 and 2009) and South Korea (1982 and 1983).
There is a rather ugly sounding English term for posthumous marriage: necrogamy.
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Post by cheerypeabrain on May 31, 2017 15:16:30 GMT
Thank you for translating Etienne's speech Kerouac. Very moving. Necrogamy...hhhmmm.. but if it gave the bereaved man some form of comfort then I expect its OK.
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Post by lagatta on May 31, 2017 18:37:42 GMT
Yes, usually it was to protect the rights of the heirs and support to the survivor (usually the mother, when the father-to-be was killed in battle or say a mining accident or at sea). In this case I honestly don't see the point as the two partners obviously loved one another and were devoted to each other, and same-sex marriage is now legal in France - but many gay, and also many straight couples prefer a PACS or other cohabitation agreement. But it is none of my business and if Mr Cardiles finds some comfort in the ceremony, tant mieux.
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Post by kerouac2 on Nov 1, 2017 4:48:35 GMT
The state of emergency which was declared in France on the night of the Bataclan attacks 14 November 2015, and which was extended by parliament six times, officially ends at last on November 1st, 2017.
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Post by kerouac2 on Jan 6, 2018 18:55:45 GMT
January 7th is the 3rd anniversary of the Charlie Hebdo massacre. I have only bought Charlie Hebdo about half a dozen times during this period, but I bought this week’s issue because rather than being satirical, it was devoted mostly to what has happened to them over the past three years.
Their offices are now in a secure fortress that includes a panic room. The three principal members of the staff have permanent police protection, but Charlie also has to pay 1.5 million euros a year for private protection. They have devoted the giant windfall of contributions and subscriptions that they received after the attack – 15 million euros – which is in a special sanctuary fund used only for this.
Their lives have completely changed. In the past, going to cafés and restaurants was an important part of their lifestyle. Now, it is out of the question to go to a local place for lunch. Every moment of the day or night when they are out on the street, they constantly look everywhere to see if anybody is following. Several of the wounded underwent two years of physical therapy to recover from their injuries.
The hate mail has never stopped and even many former supporters tell them “you went too far” and say that they should have censored themselves. As for the “hate tweets” they could build a mountain with them if they were printed out.
The latest poll says that 62% of the French are still willing to say “Je suis Charlie” but that is down from 75% last year.
It is not a perfect world.
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Post by mickthecactus on Jan 6, 2018 19:34:38 GMT
3 years? Blimey, where does the time go.
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Post by kerouac2 on Apr 20, 2018 14:13:35 GMT
Turning on the television a few minutes ago, I happened upon the ceremony commemorating the 1st anniversary of the death of Xavier Jugelé. President Macron was there along with Mayor Hidalgo, the Minister of the Interior and of course the companion of the deceased. It's hard to believe that it's already been a year and that the world is as shitty as ever. Will it ever change?
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Post by kerouac2 on Nov 13, 2019 5:05:55 GMT
Already the 4th anniversary of the Bataclan attack today. I am still amazed that it was able to reopen and continues to function now as it always did.
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Post by htmb on Sept 1, 2020 17:35:46 GMT
So, those accused of the Charlie Hebdo massacre are now going on trial, over five years after the killings. I admit, I haven’t read any of the recent articles about the upcoming trials, only that they are happening, but I have to wonder why these things seemingly take so long to commence.
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Post by kerouac2 on Sept 1, 2020 18:17:48 GMT
The fact that they are all dead also puts another spin on the matter.
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Post by htmb on Sept 1, 2020 19:09:05 GMT
I read there are two or three who escaped, possibly through Spain, so they are being tried in absentia. I’ll have to go read more, I suppose.
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Post by kerouac2 on Sept 1, 2020 20:29:31 GMT
Those were the people who assisted the terrorists or who were maybe just friends even though they had radical ideas. Two of the three are presumed dead, and the woman is apparently in a camp in Syria.
Whenever they finally get around to the Bataclan trial, at least they have one survivor to put on trial -- the guy who wimped out at the last minute and hid in the bushes for several days.
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Post by htmb on Sept 1, 2020 20:43:27 GMT
Ah. Thanks, Kerouac. The BBC article I saw showed a photo of a courtroom at the new, and impressive, Tribunal, so I assume that’s where these legal activities will be taking place, rather than on the Île de la Cîté.
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