LouisXIV
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L'estat c'est moi.
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Post by LouisXIV on Jan 16, 2017 15:10:47 GMT
WTF? or What the French? I found it an interesting read. My first trip to France was in 1997 and according to this book it looks like there have been a lot of changes. Just wondering if anyone on this forum has read it and if it is a fair representation of things currently in France. Especially from those living in France. I currently have a French foreign exchange student and I am noticing some of the changes with him. In general, he is more like an American teenager with a French accent. The cloths, McDonalds, hamburgs, hot dogs, pasta are his favorite foods. The only think he wants for breakfast is bread and Nutela. And not good French bread, which you can not find here in the USA, but the ultra cheap white bread. FYI: The book has one whole chapter on Nutela. How strongly the French have gone over to fast food like McDonalds. I couldn't believe all the taxes the French have to put up with. It seems the government in involved in all aspects of life. I find the changes interesting. www.amazon.com/WTF-What-French-Olivier-Magny/dp/042528347X |
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Post by bixaorellana on Jan 16, 2017 16:37:33 GMT
Seeing the title, I thought you were going to say that it was a diary with blank pages and a joke title.  The "lucky" people in the US probably do pay fewer taxes than the French. But the French, because their government uses taxes to give them true health care, don't pay out monster premiums for health insurance. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2017 22:16:46 GMT
Olivier Magny is a professional tit. Anyone who is called "the Jamie Oliver of wine" doesn't really earn a lot of respect from people who know and love France.
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LouisXIV
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L'estat c'est moi.
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Post by LouisXIV on Jan 17, 2017 0:18:09 GMT
I feel the amount of taxes they pay in France would be much more than what is paid for insurance in the USA. The biggest reasons for high health care costs is the insurance companies and the government. But it takes self disciplined people to plan for their health care and retirement and that is definitely what the masses do not have, self discipline. The masses of this world seem to want to delegate many important areas of their life to the government and companies like insurance companies, the result is they pay dearly for this.
Dr. Carson had the only common sense plan to health care and that was his health savings account, it is a step in the right direction, but could in the long run really help lower costs. The biggest problem is that currently the masses have been brain washed that the government and insurance companies are the only way to handle their health care, at least in the USA. When you are sick you go to your doctor or in some cases a hospital to solve you health problem. The government and insurance companies do NOTHING to solve your health problems, ONLY to finance them.
I couple years ago I talked to my mothers heart doctor during the the start of the Obama Care. She told me that 33% of every dollar she bills is spent to get paid by the insurance companies and the government. My own doctor confirmed this. That is 33% of your health care costs being pissed away on paper work. That is just one of of the reasons for high health care costs, the staff the doctor has to employ to get paid. Then the the attorneys that are making a fortune off of doctors or the doctors insurance companies that pay the attorneys and we the patient pays for the malpractice insurance the doctor has to get to protect himself.
Harry Truman had a sign on his desk, "The Buck Stops Here". The Americans all need the same sign on them and start taking responsibility for their life.
The older I get the more I see the wisdom of 1 Corinthians 15:55
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Post by bixaorellana on Jan 17, 2017 0:51:03 GMT
Looking around the net -- and anyone can feel free to correct me -- it seems that in the US the average monthly health insurance premium is $328. Supposedly government subsidies would lower that amount. So, being cautious and assuming $200 a month for health care alone, that is $2400 dollars a year. Since we're talking averages, are we to assume that every man, woman and child in France is paying out $2400 every year plus whatever other taxes a citizen would reasonably owe for those little doo-dads such as public roads, police protection, etc.? As for this: But it takes self disciplined people to plan for their health care and retirement and that is definitely what the masses do not have, self discipline. The masses of this world seem to want to delegate many important areas of their life to the government and companies like insurance companies, the result is they pay dearly for this. The masses???! So every person who winds up without enough cash to fund his/her retirement and any medical expenses is some kind of lay-about who pissed away every penny earned in the expectation that the government would take care of it? Seriously?  !!! Carson is an idiot. www.ontheissues.org/2016/Ben_Carson_Health_Care.htm1 Corinthians 15:55 -- “Where, O death, is your victory? Where, O death, is your sting?” ~?~ In this context, what does that mean? Maybe that "the masses" who die because they have no medical coverage suffer until they're glad to croak? I am continually stunned that there are people whose political beliefs seem entirely based on the terror that one of their tax pennies might go to someone "undeserving", yet those same people are quick to quote the New Testament and to identify themselves as Christians. Paying taxes is a way of sharing. Here is what the New Testament says about sharing: www.openbible.info/topics/sharing |
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LouisXIV
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L'estat c'est moi.
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Post by LouisXIV on Jan 17, 2017 1:41:14 GMT
I have no problem with sharing or charity, but I do not feel it is not the job of the government or others to tell me how to share.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 17, 2017 5:19:33 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jan 17, 2017 5:28:50 GMT
Amaaaaazing how this thread turned on a dime. Almost like there was an agenda…
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Post by fumobici on Jan 17, 2017 16:23:22 GMT
The US system is a giant grift, with Americans paying over twice per person what civilized countries with universal single-payer systems cost. But at least in the US, those horrible "takers" and parasites don't get covered. It's *very* important for poor people to suffer so that we can feel better about ourselves. Even if it costs us thousands of dollars a year to make certain they do suffer. Right?  |
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Post by bixaorellana on Jan 17, 2017 17:33:56 GMT
I have no problem with sharing or charity, but I do not feel it is not the job of the government or others to tell me how to share. But Louis, taxes ARE sharing. Obviously everyone doesn't agree with how the government apportions tax revenue, but the only way around that is to either stop paying taxes and go to jail (where your keep will be paid by taxes) or to give up your citizenship and try to find a country that levies no taxes. Lotsa luck on that. |
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Post by patricklondon on Jan 17, 2017 18:04:13 GMT
I don't understand paying taxes as an act of sharing charity, it's the membership fee for a civilised society. We can all have different opinions about what constitutes a civilised society, and therefore about what the membership should cover and how high it should be; but for me and pretty well all my compatriots, a national healthcare system is part of a society that is both civilised and effective. Seen one way it expresses the moral principle that "I am my brother's keeper", seen another, it pools risk, costs and contributions, between the different members of the community at any one time, and between the different phases of one's own life from one's healthy working and taxpaying self to one's sick and vulnerable self. And it leaves a lot of the key decisions of principle about what the service should cover, and how, to somewhere closer to an overt, transparent and democratic process rather than the unfathomable workings of the "hidden hand" of manipulable markets. My blog | My photos | My video clips"too literate to be spam" |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 17, 2017 18:35:55 GMT
Hear, hear!
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Post by bixaorellana on Jan 17, 2017 20:20:12 GMT
Patrick, I don't think you were addressing me in particular, but just in case -- I said taxes were sharing, not that they were "sharing charity".
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Post by lagatta on Jan 17, 2017 20:39:35 GMT
Americans who oppose using taxation to fund healthcare (note that it is cheaper, even here in Canada, although we have far too many private clinics) never seem to complain about taxes being used to fund highways and other roads, or the police and fire departments. Not to mention the MILITARY.
And yes, Olivier Magny is a tit. And more than a bit of a racist. (Note that I'm not someone who is soft on religious fundamentalists of any faith, whether Daesh or Dr Carson - they all share bloodlust and hatred of women). But Magny has horrible stereotypes about people who aren't of his upper-income, pur porc French milieu.
His "Stuff Parisians Like" isn't entirely untrue, but it is about a certain type of Parisian, the type to be scrupulously avoided. Fortunately I know lovely people in Paris, some native French, some whose parents were immigrants, some who migrated there themselves for a variety of reasons from asylum to interest to work to love... who are nothing like the nasty people he describes.
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Post by chexbres on Jan 18, 2017 8:49:35 GMT
Well, Olivier Magny is making a mint from Anglophone tourists who come to Paris to see his show - and walk out believing every word he uttered.
A self-funded insurance plan would be nice, if people had money to put toward it.
What about the millions of people who don't or can't find work?
What about retirees, many of whom are on severely limited fixed incomes?
This is only a solution for people who have extra money on hand.
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Post by bjd on Jan 18, 2017 9:01:31 GMT
Not only is it a solution only for people who have extra money on hand, I don't really think it's a good idea. How many people are competent enough to sift through all the small print on insurance forms to find out exactly what will be covered and with how much deductible, etc. When we know that until the Affordable Care Act, American insurance companies could refuse people with pre-existing conditions, just for one example.
I must be living in a closet -- never heard of Olivier Magny. Will have a look on Youtube.
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Post by lagatta on Jan 18, 2017 11:49:39 GMT
I forget how I happened upon his vapid blog; perhaps the Thorn Tree long ago? Haven't looked at it in years. I think I answered back when it was clear that he wasn't just nasty and snobbish but also racist. I had completely forgotten about the pompous little prick; there are enough of those here, and everywhere else.
As for healthcare, even better-off people usually wind up spending less when there is universal public coverage. Sure there is a lot of criticism, as well there should be, but most people here are very attached to the system and the Conservatives wouldn't have dared to destroy it. It has been hollowed-out and undermined in many ways, as is the case of its UK inspiration, but that is a constant fight. There aren't enough public clinics for one thing, which was an important facet of the system here in Québec.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 18, 2017 15:07:06 GMT
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Post by bixaorellana on Jan 18, 2017 15:48:16 GMT
I must be completely tone-deaf, as the excerpt did not seem racist, at least the part I could see. His tone in general is pretty annoying, though.
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Post by bjd on Jan 18, 2017 15:49:00 GMT
I did look him up on YouTube and listened to an interview in French about another book. I realized too that I had seen him recently talking about wine, in English, and he does speak English very well.
However, after reading the excerpt from his book that Lizzy linked to, and remembering what he said in the interview I watched, I think you shouldn't take him seriously. He definitely seems to be doing this as a joke, trying to get people not to take themselves so seriously.
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Post by lagatta on Jan 18, 2017 16:00:49 GMT
Yes, it has to be denounced as, among other things, a racist tract.
Note that the stuff against (non-European) immigrants didn't even mention radical Islamic terrorists (a legitimate fear, and not only among 'pur-porc' French. It is things like hip-hop. Actually French slam, rap and hip-hop are often exceptional. Paris is an important centre for so-called 'world music'. But this shithead associates that important métissé cultural product with 'la racaille' (hoodlums, bums, street gangs).
He must really see K2's hood as a 'no-go zone', and I doubt very much that he has set foot in the nearby wine bar...
And must be utterly horrified at naming a transport hub after Rosa Parks!
Bixa, he's legitimising the Front national with a lot of dog-whistle references (similar to those of Trump's campaign) and has often written about 'la racaille' in terms making it evident that he is referring to North and West African youth. His stuff about hip-hop was just an example of what he sees as this 'infection'. He also doesn't think 'native' (white) Frenchmen are masculine enough...
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Post by Deleted on Jan 18, 2017 16:24:32 GMT
I must be completely tone-deaf, as the excerpt did not seem racist, at least the part I could see. His tone in general is pretty annoying, though. Did you read as far as the chapter "Africanization", bixa? The general tone:  |
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Post by bixaorellana on Jan 18, 2017 17:00:23 GMT
No, that didn't show up in the sample I got. As I said, "the part I could see".
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Post by lagatta on Jan 18, 2017 17:22:19 GMT
And especially titling that 'Africanization'. Some of what he says there holds true, and not only in France, in the face of global corporate culture (sometimes called 'American' culture, but it also menaces many local cultures even within the US, and obviouusly elsewhere in the Americas).
Most Africans in France, whether Maghrebi (North African), West or Central (Subsaharan, aka Black African cultures) are very French indeed. Not to mention people from the French Caribbean.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 18, 2017 17:53:32 GMT
Frankly, it doesn't horrify me that people laugh at this sort of humour. After all, comedy is based on the exaggeration of stereotypes of all sorts ("My mother-in-law is so horrible that..."). The problem come up when either the 'comedian' or the audience begin to take the subject too seriously. Most of what I have read does not bother me, but sometimes the line is crossed in an unpleasant manner. Just about every comedian does this since we always think that certain things are unfunny or too off-colour. I will not call for a lynch mob about this guy today. My mother taught me that the best response to most insults is just to ignore them. Becoming angry tells the other person that the aim was accurate.
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Post by lagatta on Jan 18, 2017 18:05:00 GMT
En effet, c'est très parisien, le second degré...
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Post by Deleted on Jan 18, 2017 18:41:11 GMT
It's not alarming, just unfortunate, because readers from other countries will take his word as objective reality. It's not a book for the home market.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 18, 2017 18:42:51 GMT
Well, Olivier Magny is making a mint from Anglophone tourists who come to Paris to see his show - and walk out believing every word he uttered. Chexbres, different Olivier, although they both seem to make a living out of explaining French culture to foreigners. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 18, 2017 18:44:29 GMT
Yes, I looked it up too -- the performer is Olivier Giraud, with whom I have exchanged sharp private messages in the past.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 18, 2017 18:59:10 GMT
Any hopes of seeing excerpts, perhaps in "Gems from other Forums"? |
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!!!
