Fantastic. We gave now 3 governments. Germanophone region Wallonia. Bruxelles capitale or communauté française. Never understood. Only lacking a Flemish and a federal government. After 100 days. Great. According to a poll from the Laatste nieuws (big Flemish newspapers) in case of an election things would remain the same in Wallonia but in Flanders vlaams belang (far right) would become nr 1 party then N-va. ...
Seems we are putting oïl on the communautary issue since the last poll showing Flanders becoming extreme-right. Here a interesting comment from JC Junkers who speaks German at the belgian coast. Apparently the belgian coast has become the flemish coast and you are not welcome anymore if you speak french. Been a long time I haven't been to the coast, last time we were in family, so we were speaking french and flemish and I didn't realize if it was really so. But my father sold his apartment after repeatedly told he had no say in the meetings since he was not a local.
Post by bixaorellana on Sept 15, 2019 17:11:27 GMT
Even though I greatly appreciate that this thread exists in order to give the rest of us a look at how Belgium functions, I generally never comment because it's all so bewildering. It turns out that wikipedia even has an entry called Politics of Belgium: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Politics_of_Belgium
Once I wade through that, I might be able to at least ask a not totally stupid question or two.
From what little I understand, Belgian's form of voting seems quite admirable. The link above stresses the importance of unions in the country, including the information that they are Not simply a "bread and butter" movement in the American sense, Belgian labour unions take positions on education, public finance, defence spending, environmental protection, women's rights, abortion, and other issues. They also provide a range of services, including the administration of unemployment benefits.
This must work well, as another nugget gleaned from google states: Belgium is the fourth-most-productive country by GDP (PPP) per hour worked (60.98 USD).
Apparently the belgian coast has become the flemish coast and you are not welcome anymore if you speak french.
What are you insinuating? Knokke-Le Zoute is 80% francophone. In De Panne one is addressed in French in most cases. Apparently you haven't been to the Belgian coast for some time! And I think it's time to STOP this Flemish/French thing. It is just because of people like you that this issue (for you at least) is being maintained and hatred fed.
Fantastic. We gave now 3 governments. Germanophone region Wallonia. Bruxelles capitale or communauté française. Never understood. Only lacking a Flemish and a federal government. After 100 days. Great.
441 days to go to break the record. What's your problem?
Well Amboseli ur seems we will not be friends even without meeting in the flesh.
Maybe it is 'because of people like you' that the problem is not solved. I am spreading hatred by saying that half of the Flemish are now openly voting for extremist parties which are xenophobic racist and want Belgium to explode. Half Is One out of two. You haven't got frenchspeaking children who come back - yearly- From a one week stay in Knokke saying she heard people chanting ' les Wallons c'est du merde ' (sic - youngsters don't speak french as well as they did). But probably she is fueledby my hatred I speak everyday Flemish and spent my military duty in a flemishunit and I worked several years in Flanders - because I hate Flemish. Open your eyes. Half Of your community wants to be rid of us. Dewever wants to kill Belgium or go towards conferalism. Know what co federalism is ? Not Switzerland which is a federal state. Confederalusm is two indépendant countries which decide to have some things in common. Usually the army and foreign affairs.
With each élections separatists win Flanders.
But saying it is creating the problem ? Too bad if I am part of the problem. I am probably one of the walloons who like the most the Flemish. Imagine the others ../ Junkers is no belgian actually - but he cannot be trusted of course. Allez. Belgie barst!!
I suppose i made this slogan myself too.
A quarter of the Flemish vote for the guys who made this : they like us ?
Ridiculous political squabbling is a luxury of our rich countries. Unfortunately, it is always the poor or lower middle class who are taken hostage along the way with stupid promises which will not (cannot) be kept. France, the UK, Spain, Italy have all been through this (are still going through this) -- and lots of other countries, too.
Divide and conquer (or divide and rule) goes back to Roman times, and it works just as well as ever, anywhere in the world. Divide and Conquer wiki
Somebody is always benefitting from the divisions. We are just pawns.
As for Belgium, as I have always understood it, the Walloons used to dominate the Flemish. But over time, the Flemish economy flourished while the Walloon economy declined (mining, etc.) and the Flemish no longer accepted this domination, which is quite a normal reaction but not good for a bicultural nation. The country split in two (we'll ignore Brussels for the moment.) so that the rich would no longer have their money drained away by the lazy poor (sound familiar in some other countries?). Newspapers and other media (not to mention politicians) have been fuelling the fire ever since, so it is not getting better.
If I am not mistaken, there has been no national linguistic census in Belgium since 1947 because of the fear of finding out unpleasant truths. (From what I understand, that truth would be that the Walloons outnumber the Flemish, which would once again upset the balance of power.) However, certain towns and areas were transferred back and forth in 1962 (divine intervention?).
It has always been my understanding that walloons are roughly 3.5 millions brusseleers 1 million and 6.5 millions Flemish and a few hundreds thousands for German speaking. I would find it difficult to say that a census frenchspeaking outnumber the other community. Wikipedia gives 4.5 millions for communauté française. Or we should add migrants.
Ah. Kerouac. I think you mean Bruxelles. That Flemish authorities have tried for years to populate with good Flemish. The census would fir example give a répartition key for politics and civil servants even doctors. Seems the best census is obtained via statistics of language used when calling the firemen 👹
Yes, I know. It has become as ridiculous as that due to no official census. Problem?
Of course, it can be tricky in France, too. Since questions of ethnic origin are forbidden, the closest they can get to finding out a bit regarding the origin of the people living in France is to ask in which country they were born. Kind of stupid too, since probably for 100 people of Maghrebi origin in 2019, about 90% of them were born in France or another European country.
Naturally, there are also "unofficial" statistics...
In the meantime we are 5 months after elections and not closer to get a federal government. Newspapers say that we - the people - don't care anymore. Last times there were protests Belgian flags etc. This time nothing. We are becoming fatalist but also our respect for the politicians is sinking fast.
Niw6 months after elections. Still no nearer to have a governmentwalloin socialists keep saying it is impossible to have a givernlent with Flemish nationalists. Flemish N VA saying they must be in the government. Great. We should lock them in a room and stop feeding them until they form a government. Idiots.
Meanwhile. More than one year with a minority government and 8 months with a power limited one. And no nearer to a solution. But. There was a meeting last week between N VA and PS. Ain't that great. Now for the Ines of you who don't care there is no oroblem. We don't care anymore either.
I always wonder if any money is being saved due to the unfilled positions and staff that has not ben recruited to assist them. Obviously, all of the 'interim' people are costing a lot, but does it balance out? Only the taxpayers will ever know.
We've had a similar issue in Northern Ireland, where the devolved government/assembly system depends on making the parties from both communities share office and power, no matter how extreme they might consider each other's objectives to be.
Two years ago, the leading parties on each side fell out over the (mis-)management of a scheme for environmental grants, leaving no ministers in place, just the civil servants administering existing systems and laws, and the assembly members hanging on to their salaries and offices, but not actually legislating or doing much other business in the assembly.
In the meantime, all the hooha over Br#x#t, and Theresa May's loss of a majority put one Northern Ireland party in a key position in Westminster, and not in a mood to compromise on anything much (par for the course) so the stalemate at Stormont dragged on.
Then December's Westminster election showed marked setbacks for the leading parties in both communities, and a clear majority at Westminster which didn't need any other parties' support. And suddenly, the hint that, if there was no agreement on reviving the government at Stormont, there'd have to be new elections there, with the prospect of some lost seats and salaries, produced an agreement pretty sharpish.
Same here. I have already decided that if there are elections i wont vote. It soundz to me like a teacher seeing her new class in september. Oh no i dont like that group. Give me other children. Wtf ? You know choose the results of the elections to form a government ?