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Post by onlyMark on Feb 3, 2020 17:26:30 GMT
The nearest shop, which is a supermarket, is about 1.5km away. My original leaving date was to be 28th Feb and I'd started advertising the car well in advance of that so I had plenty of time and little pressure to sell it. One expat we know left it a little too late. He advertised it and a colleague from a similar organisation, the World Bank, had arrived and decided to buy it. But, he said he couldn't afford it all in one go and organised paying in installments, even though we all knew he could afford it. The buyer paid one installment, there was to be four, the seller left, the buyer paid half of the next installment and then said, when asked about the shortfall, the car was over priced and he's not going to pay any more for it. All the expat community got to know about this deceit and are in effect, sending him to Coventry. But, he's apparently not bothered and refuses to pay.
Hence, my caution and not releasing the car until full payment, no matter it is also a colleague who has bought it. So I wanted to have plenty of time. It is a good job I did this as my exit date because of my brother has come forward by 18 days. All this is leading to the fact that knowing we'd be without a car for some weeks, I'd stocked up on loads of foodstuffs so I only needed to buy the essentials from time to time. I wont get a taxi there but walk anyway, but not if I have to buy a lot of heavy stuff. Now my date has come forward, we have far too much stuff and even though Mrs M is staying for some time, there are things she wouldn't eat or not eat enough of. These will be given away at some point.
Taxis are not cheap here but there is an Uber type app called Ulendo which I will use if necessary.
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Post by questa on Feb 3, 2020 23:14:27 GMT
What a good idea to give tools to the charity...the sort of thing that keeps on giving. Is a camshaft belt the same as what here gets called a timing belt? My Hyundai needs the belt replaced, but it will cost almost what the car is worth and I may not be driving for much longer...
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Post by lagatta on Feb 4, 2020 0:04:49 GMT
Mark, while I hope you can convince your brother to live in reality, please don't make that the focus of your move, as the success rate in such ventures is dismal. If he has a suicide wish I doubt very much you can be of much use. Obviously, I hope I'm wrong.
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Post by onlyMark on Feb 4, 2020 7:53:43 GMT
Questa, yes, same thing. Diesel engines though tend to have a timing chain rather than a belt as in petrol engines.
Lagatta, you are right. I don't hold out much hope but I would regret it if I didn't try. The latest is that due to his mental state he has now a restraining order to keep him away from his ex-partner and where she lives, which is where he used to live. Unfortunately he went there on Saturday and Sunday and was ushered away. Monday he went again and the police were called. They removed him and warned him he will go to prison if he goes again, There seems to be an automatic four month spell he would be in for - depending I suppose on what a magistrate or judge would say. It may help him as he would then have 24 hour care and attention, food and shelter plus possible medical attention and no alcohol.
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Post by questa on Feb 4, 2020 9:47:52 GMT
Do you have drying out centres where patients like your brother can be confined and treated, rather than prisons? Still there are many stories of the regular "three hots and a cot" that have put people back into a fairly normal social way of life again. (3 hot meals a day and a bed).
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Post by onlyMark on Feb 4, 2020 10:46:20 GMT
There are centres that will help but they cannot be confined apart from if a Judge deems they are incapable or a threat to themselves or the public. The Judge who issued the restraining order is not of this opinion. There is another option, which is relevant in the UK but I have no idea in Spain, though I do expect something similar, is that if the person is taken to a hospital and two or even maybe three doctors agree, then they can be detained - as mentioned it is called being "Sectioned" which are parts of the Mental Health Act. Currently he is not sufficiently incapable or non compos mentis for this to apply.
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Post by lagatta on Feb 4, 2020 13:10:26 GMT
Your details relate to one of the cases I was thinking of in my gloomy reply. A co-worker; one of those people who is able to function despite an upper-downer addiction (cocaine, booze, and other stuff). He was obsessed with his estranged wife and wanted to kill her (he was nuts enough to actually tell me that). But her brother, a very nice man and what was called un homme rose (a male feminist) actually had to go threaten to beat the shit out of him, in the patriarchal protective bro role. My friend wasn't brawny, but he was very fit: runner, cyclist etc and definitely infinitely more fit than abusive guy.
He chain smoked (cigarettes) as well. I was not surprised to learn that he had died, not very old. That said, there are some success stories.
The main problem with the prison cure (whice I would only support in cases like this where the person is threatening to harm others; if not I think people have the right to use or abuse their own bodies) is that he might not get the support sometimes needed if a person is going cold turkey.
As you know, in many Latin countries (in the Americas and in southern Europe) there has been a lot more attention to femicide of late, so the judges might be severe if there is such a risk.
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Post by kerouac2 on Feb 4, 2020 16:06:10 GMT
Spain has made an enormous amount of progress on this subject. But it also had one of the biggest problems.
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Post by lagatta on Feb 4, 2020 23:00:02 GMT
I presume you mean femicide and other forms of violence against women, not excessive drinking. Most associate the latter with more northerly places (even northern France vs southern France).
But what Italians and Spanish call "British binge drinking" (and similar excessive use of other inebriants) has become a problem among some groups of young people in those countries.
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Post by onlyMark on Feb 9, 2020 8:30:45 GMT
Off to Spain today. Overnight journey and with several hours road travel when I get there, I won't be seeing anyone tomorrow but will settle in to my AirBnB accommodation, do some food shopping etc etc. The next day, Tuesday, a meeting has been arranged between myself and a couple of his friends and a friend of a friend who are also now involved - mainly because he keeps turning up at their apartments in his confusion. Only one problem, they don't speak English and I don't speak Spanish apart from a large number of nouns relating to building something and the names of food.
If my brother is there, than he can translate, but after speaking to him on the phone a few times, I can see that due to his short term memory loss and confusion, he'll be translating the same thing two or three times and forgetting what is said anyway so it has to be repeated to him. But, we'll get through it.
His (ex)partner and mother of his children, who now has a restraining order against him which he cannot understand why it is in place, has a mistaken impression that I will swoop in and solve everything. Over the years she has seen, heard, experienced and been told of what she thinks are my capabilities and built these up in her mind such that she has unrealistic expectations. She has said a few times over many years that she "married" the wrong brother and she has said I am a 'lighthouse'. I have no real idea what she means by that but have not pursued an explanation other to comment that all that means is I am solitary and attract moths. Interesting times are ahead.
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Post by mickthecactus on Feb 9, 2020 11:02:40 GMT
Good luck Mark.
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Post by lugg on Feb 9, 2020 18:35:32 GMT
Yes , best wishes from me too.
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Post by kerouac2 on Feb 9, 2020 19:06:04 GMT
Expectations are probably a bit our fault. We have told everybody how invincible you are.
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Post by cheerypeabrain on Feb 9, 2020 19:26:07 GMT
Yep. Supermark. Sorry meduck. Good luck tomorrow xxx
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Post by questa on Feb 9, 2020 22:01:22 GMT
An acquaintance of mine worked with the tough guys in prisons. He said when dealing with them he would see them as little 4 year old boys before circumstances of life got to them...scared, lonely, looking for love but rarely getting it. having to be the image they have created in their mind. Can you remember your brother like this? or similar?
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Post by lagatta on Feb 9, 2020 22:40:15 GMT
That might be an idea. I've also spoken about my now defunct work colleague. We use what we can, but please, Marc, don't feel guilty if you can't get through to him. Good luck.
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Post by onlyMark on Feb 11, 2020 22:52:42 GMT
No time now to answer your thoughts, but eventually I'll try. Suffice to say I saw him today, with a couple of friends. Had a chat then took him around with me to do stuff. Jeeeesus. One friend seems ok, the other seems vindictive and deceitful. My brother is mentally further gone than I was led to believe, even after speaking to him on the phone a few times. I'm not sure if my intervention regarding food, nutrition, vitamins, alcohol and drug minimizing will have the desired effect.
I also found him to be too passive about finding help. In effect he would sit all night on a square trying to sleep but it is too cold/noisy etc and do absolutely nothing about his situation. He has been found a place at a homeless shelter by his ex-partner and has been staying there for a couple of weeks at least - but he never asked anything of them about any help. In one short conversation when I went there I found half a dozen places where he can get free food, two other shelters he could go to and the details of a charity home where they would help him with drug/alcohol abuse and he could stay night and day until 'cured'.
This is what I'm up against - passivity, lack of asking for help, where/when etc, and obliviousness - both from him and his friends. I have said strongly that he isn't in a unique position. Many have gone before him - who then helped? Charity, Church, NGO's, Social Services, Pro Bono lawyers either alone or attached to different organisation, medical help, what organisation help in these circumstances in Spain? Not one bloody person, either my brother, his friends or his ex-partner have tried in earnest to find out. These places will help if asked, or at least will point you in the right direction if they can't. The Town Hall will know some and point you there. People will help if approached and asked. Ordinary people. E,g. I took him into a large bookshop we were passing to ask if they had any information about homeless organisations etc - they didn't but the shop owner was called and asked and he took us down several streets to show us where he could get free food.
I asked my brother if he had asked other homeless at the shelter or on the street as to who helped them, which organisation. Where did they stay, eat, or whatever, get money from. How did they survive and who helped. He said he'd not thought to ask. Even in his right mind I know it would still be the same answer. I asked him and his friends if there was a Social Worker assigned to him - met with blank looks. Now I know it is Spain and not the UK, but bloody hell fire, they have social services - has anyone asked them yet? No. What financial help can he get from the State? Any benefits? No matter of he can't but it needs asking from them, from a worker there who might know stuff they/we don't. Has anyone asked? Has my brother, who has no money he can get his hands on. Nope.
He is getting rent money from his apartment in which there is a couple refusing to leave, this is one of the major problems, and maybe, it isn't clear, but some benefits, he's not sure. It all gets paid into his bank, but his card isn't working in the ATM. Has he been into the bank to ask why or get it sorted? Nope. When I ask why, he and friends say they either didn't think of it or they'll get round to it or usually, as with many questions I asked, "I don't know".
Passivity, this is the major problem. Next is being happy in ignorance. Next is arrogance that no help is needed nor to be asked for. I rarely lose my temper - I know his friends have no responsibilities to him and he has a restraining order against him from his ex-partner because of various things so she is reluctant to help, but she does to a certain extent - but when I ask them all questions as to who/what/why/when/how and why not and who have they asked I found out they have little idea and I want to shout at them, "You stupid people" and bang their heads together.
Yes, I have a responsibility as well, I am well aware of that. But I live a million miles away and I naively hoped someone, and they all have my contact details, would have at least let me know that in the last few months he has gone downhill rapidly. At first I saw a slow decline over a couple of years but generally only physically. Mentally it has accelerated beyond belief. I regularly speak to him on the phone but a ten minute conversation where he talks the right story and knows what to say, leaves me very surprised when I am eventually told he does things like loosing his bowels on the front doorstep of his old apartment he lived with his ex-partner in and his daughter sees him because he was waiting for her and didn't want to move. Things like not remembering something from week to week has shortened when I saw him, from ten seconds to ten seconds without exaggeration. Ten seconds.
I have my work cut out for me.
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Post by htmb on Feb 11, 2020 23:46:58 GMT
Yes, you do, Mark. Wishing you all the best. It sounds like a very sad and extremely frustrating situation. I wish I had some magical words of wisdom to send your way.
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Post by lagatta on Feb 11, 2020 23:55:07 GMT
Yes, I was sorry to come off as so negative when responding to you, but I've witnessed several such situations. One is a famous author of Indigenous origin (my cousin's ex-spouse). Two others were journalists long committed to social issues.
Good luck but please don't harm your own physical or mental health, or feel guity if he refuses your aid.
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Post by questa on Feb 12, 2020 0:39:22 GMT
Oh Mark, you certainly do have your work cut out for you. It sounds to me like he has given up caring for anything, even if he lives or dies. It is a strange sort of death by apathy. Living like you have described is all too hard, he must make decisions but even tiny ones cause anxiety and stress so he just avoids them. And so he drifts along, self medicating to dull the demons and waiting for someone to fix it for him.
Please tell me to shut up if I'm intruding on your territory. I'd be inclined to hit the easy stuff first...shower, hair cut and shave or trim beard, new clothes and shoes (or neat op-shop ones). Visit the various accommodation places and see if he can be moved into somewhere that has a bit of supervision. Check with the Church facilities, men's groups etc.
Memory is tricky. You could talk about good times as young brothers and encourage him to tell you more recent things but I would be checking out social workers or psychologists for guidance. If your brother is willing to go into rehab, ...Congratulations.
Sorry if I have blundered in where angels fear to tread, Yell at me if it helps!
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Post by kerouac2 on Feb 12, 2020 5:45:48 GMT
I've known a couple of people over the years who have come close to hitting bottom. Both were saved but only when a family member stepped in full time to get them back on track. There is one advantage of total passivity -- they do not resist being told what to do, but then you have to accompany them to get it done. Once a few things are fixed, they begin to see the light at the end of the tunnel.
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Post by onlyMark on Feb 12, 2020 6:59:13 GMT
htmb, when you think of them, let me know. lagatta, didn't see it as negativity, just realism, no problem. questa, yesterday was spent in what you might call 'familiarisation' whilst we moved around, doing some enquiries neither he nor his friends had even thought of and a few urgent things for me, like buying me a fleece and some socks because it is bloody cold here at night in comparison to my previous life. Today is going to the bank but first shit, shower and shave time with clothes washing. K2, agree that is the only course of action. He has though one sticking point in that at the moment he would refuse to stay overnight anywhere like a mental health facility or similar establishment. I've not gotten to the root of that at the moment but suspect it's an influence from our parents who always strongly refused to stay in hospital as they felt once you were in there, you died.
Must go now though and get him.
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Post by mossie on Feb 12, 2020 9:16:53 GMT
Very difficult Mark, I can only sympathise.
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Post by spaceneedle on Feb 12, 2020 9:47:44 GMT
Mark,
I obviously don't know you as well as others here do (as I've also been absent from here for a while) but I've experienced your scenario with a sibling myself. It is a very tough position to be placed in and there is a risk of what is referred to as 'compassion fatigue'.
Also, when there is an addiction in a family, family members play certain roles with the afflicted person. The "hero" sibling is one of them. This is the sibling who swoops in and fixes things for the troubled sibling. It is a thankless and very challenging position to be put in, because it often results in exhaustion, disappointment and resentment.
I can tell you more privately if you wish, via private message. You have your work cut out for you, especially trying to deal with all of this in a different language as well.
Be sure and practice lots of self care, because you will probably need it.
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Post by mickthecactus on Feb 12, 2020 12:17:37 GMT
I can only echo what mossie said Mark.
Knowing you as we do from here it seems amazing that your brother is a complete opposite to you.
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Post by onlyMark on Feb 12, 2020 18:30:07 GMT
I agree with all the above comments and I'm aware of the things like spaceneedle mentioned and I hasten to add, I am grateful for everyone's concern but to mention the stress, anxiety, compassion fatigue and so on are a factor though I think a person's reaction to these things may well be relative to their life experiences. My brother is, without doubt an opposite of me, in a bad way, but in every way. I'll mention, I hope not so much in a bragging way though it may sound like it, it really is just an example, if I can survive five or so years dealing most days with fatal road accidents, which I was a specialist in and had to be qualified in of all things, a couple of weeks throwing my weight around and telling people what's what, finding out information and acting in short order on it, asking questions nobody seems to have thought of or know the answer to but point me in the right direction for me to chase something further - I can see this as an interesting holiday with a personal slant to it.
An example of this is I've spent nearly all day chasing bank accounts. There is 'evidence' he has three. I want to know, and the authorities will also want to know, how much money he has. All I had was the name of the bank, not the branch, just the names. As trying to achieve something in Spain over the internet has many obstacles, mostly the language but other road blocks as well, I knew a personal visit with my brother in tow and with his ID may well achieve results. So yes, all sorted and clarified. An interesting exercise in 'who knows what' and 'where are they'. A kind manager slipped me the PIN for one of the cards he has when she wasn't supposed to so he could at least get some pocket money when he needed it. I asked him that I know he's had no money at all for several weeks and problems with a couple of cards he has so he can't get any, so what did he do about it? Nothing, was the reply, I was going to he said.
The homeless shelter has more resources than has been dug into yet and all it took was a couple of questions. In effect, they have access to a drink/drug rehabilitation clinic, an in-house lawyer who we saw today, and an in-house doctor who has a practice nearby of which tomorrow we will change his doctor to that one. They also gave information about how to obtain a free lawyer from a set of chambers in the next street. Everything though takes much, much longer than necessary because of having to have him translate and he often doesn't get it and then having to go over the same ground innumerable times because he demands an explanation. Also things like the question, are you married gives and answer of no but five minutes later, yes. Well, being married is quite important and does change a lot of situations, yet he cannot remember.
After years of knowing my brother and knowing the prevarication and procrastination he is inclined to continually exercise, I never really came here with a lot of compassion in the first place. This has been eroded and eroded over decades and he knows my position in that I am not here for him to have a shoulder to cry on, I am here to 'do stuff' that sorts his life out better. Practical stuff and to build a framework of assistance that will run itself when I am gone. He is fully aware, and I have told him many times each day, that if he drinks, I am gone. If he takes drugs, I am gone. If he wants my help he will take it and not argue about it otherwise, and as there are enough obstacles as it is, him putting more in my path is not a 'good thing' and I am gone.
It seems every problem he has had over the years, be it physical, practical or mental, or anything else just gets left as he can work around them or just forget about them, until now where he has too many unresolved problems and has eventually asked for help.
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Post by kerouac2 on Feb 12, 2020 18:42:55 GMT
The fact that he finally asked for help is certainly the first step on the road to redemption.
I don't understand these useless "friends," though. Are they Spanish? British? Are they functioning normally in society or are they drunks and drug addicts?
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Post by mickthecactus on Feb 12, 2020 18:55:24 GMT
I've got a few problems Mark.
Once you are done could you pop over and sort them out for me?
Thanks....
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Post by onlyMark on Feb 12, 2020 19:44:22 GMT
k2, they are normal working Spanish. Which means their inaction or lack of knowledge surprised me somewhat.
Mick, put the kettle on, I'll be round in an hour.
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Post by cheerypeabrain on Feb 12, 2020 20:53:12 GMT
You are a top bloke young Mark. Good luck medear.
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