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Post by bixaorellana on Jan 31, 2020 18:13:49 GMT
Because that's what they are?
Didn't see Kerouac's comment when I posted the above. And I disagree with Kerouac on this.
Of course I realize that Romance languages have that unfortunate gender thing built in, but in English feminizing words for professions seems to point up the fact that any woman not a nurse, teacher, or housekeeper is somehow a phenomenon, and in a subliminal way, not as much of the real thing as a man in the same profession.
I probably reflexively still say "actress" a lot of the time, simply because the word has been around so long, but it really should be "actor".
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Post by whatagain on Jan 31, 2020 18:29:24 GMT
Should we say mister to a woman
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Post by bixaorellana on Jan 31, 2020 18:31:28 GMT
Ms. / Miz
Note that in the higher levels of society, you get to be "your royal highness" or "your excellency", whether man or woman.
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Post by whatagain on Jan 31, 2020 18:34:46 GMT
Strangely we try to use female forms here .but doctoresse has never caught e cept in porn movies
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Post by onlyMark on Jan 31, 2020 18:41:29 GMT
I German you tend to put an "in" at the end more or less. That's as far as I know, but I am sure very, very few German women object to having this and not just a word that is good for both to as the sex can't be identified. If there can be an "in" at the end then there is.
Many, many years ago in the police, we each had a collar number (still do) but the format was such that female officers could be identified as female because of their number. Some objected and demanded the same format as the men. No problem the authorities said, so all women officers had their number changed. Then they suddenly remembered a female could be identified by them being, say, Pw 107 especially in paperwork, instead of Pc 107. So we all became Pc's.
One woman then objected to not being able to wear trousers. They had skirts and culottes. No problem, trousers were made. The same woman objected to the fact that the tailoring was different between men and women's trousers. She wanted the male style. No problem, and even though 99% of the women objected, when the trousers they had wore out, they were given a male one to replace it. Then the same woman Pc started on the tunics, and the hats and anything that could identify her as a female. Funnily enough, truncheons were smaller for women, so they got chucked away and they were all given the male size one (stop it, you dirty minded people). Each time, for what I expect was fear by the bosses of being labelled sexist, her wishes were considered seriously.
However, when a sympathetic stores person allowed all the male members of my shift to turn up on parade one day wearing skirts, we were sent home to change.
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Post by whatagain on Jan 31, 2020 18:42:32 GMT
Ms. / Miz Note that in the higher levels of society, you get to be "your royal highness" or "your excellency", whether man or woman. Madame for our queen sire fod the king monseigneur for the prince in Belgium!
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Post by kerouac2 on Jan 31, 2020 18:46:01 GMT
Yes, in French there are a few feminine forms like doctoresse that have been spurned for at least 50 years. I'm not sure about the other French speaking countries, but we also had the problem of usage for certain words -- présidente, ambassadrice, mairesse and a few others meant "the wife of" the president or the ambassador or the mayor because there was no way that a woman could fulfil that function.
That is changing at last.
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Post by cheerypeabrain on Jan 31, 2020 20:39:12 GMT
My professional title was Biomedical Scientist no gender tag. Senior nurses are called 'Sister' if female. The role was traditionally a female one, but when men entered the profession it would have been daft to call them 'Sister' so 'Charge Nurse' is used for men in that position. I don't know of any male Matrons (head nurse) ...presumably they will just be called 'head of nursing'.
Most of the other healthcare professionals don't have different titles for male or female...radiographer, physiotherapist, pharmacist, doctor etc. It seems ridiculous to differentiate between male and female actors...
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Post by mickthecactus on Jan 31, 2020 21:10:15 GMT
I hate to disagree with Cheery and Bixa, partly because they are far cleverer than me and partly because they might hit me next time we meet. But why can't we be different because we are? Actress and comedienne have been around for ever. It conveys the difference. Doctoresse has never been used as far as I am aware but I bow to Whatagain's superior knowledge of porn films. One day we might all be hermaphrodite in which case it will be acceptable.
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Post by bixaorellana on Jan 31, 2020 22:19:33 GMT
Sorry, Mick. Those kind of tags subtly convey the message that there is a norm and that there are things outside the norm, such as "lady doctor" or "woman pilot".
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Post by mickthecactus on Jan 31, 2020 22:22:29 GMT
We shall have to agree to differ.
Vive la difference.
Why do you want give yourselves masculine names?
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Post by Kimby on Jan 31, 2020 22:27:28 GMT
I don’t like awkward attempts to make a term like Chairman fit both genders. Chairperson sounds awful. Madam Chairman is awkward.
Some terms work equally well in English for both sexes. Doctor, teacher, scientist, etc. There is no need for a feminized word for any of these.
Nurse became Male Nurse when it was a man, but now I think just “nurse” is standard practice.
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Post by mickthecactus on Jan 31, 2020 22:34:24 GMT
Spot on Kimby.
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Post by kerouac2 on Jan 31, 2020 22:38:32 GMT
I think that the majority of nurses in France are now men (just as the majority of doctors are women). For nurses, we have the terms infirmier and infirmière, so at least you generally know the sex of the person before they walk through the door to do things to you.
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Post by Kimby on Feb 1, 2020 0:51:25 GMT
Maybe there is a rationale for knowing the gender of someone who is going to be up close with your bare body.
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Post by bjd on Feb 1, 2020 10:29:42 GMT
Why do I keep having to explain to owners of large dogs that are not on a leash that I am uncomfortable when they come over and start sniffing at me? I never used to be afraid of dogs and am still not particularly so, but keep your damn dog on a leash, don't just tell me that he is friendly! Il est gentil. Yeah, surely, but he knows his owner, he doesn't know me.
Even worse when I am with a small grandchild who is scared of dogs and some owner tells the kid not to be afraid. Meanwhile, just about any big dog is the size of a Shetland pony with respect to a two year-old.
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Post by whatagain on Feb 1, 2020 10:32:28 GMT
At least someone recognize my expertise in porn movies. Next topic could be hostesses. Not only in porn but it seems the word is being changed into flight attendant or something like that?
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Post by whatagain on Feb 1, 2020 10:37:13 GMT
Why do I keep having to explain to owners of large dogs that are not on a leash that I am uncomfortable when they come over and start sniffing at me? I never used to be afraid of dogs and am still not particularly so, but keep your damn dog on a leash, don't just tell me that he is friendly! Il est gentil. Yeah, surely, but he knows his owner, he doesn't know me. Even worse when I am with a small grandchild who is scared of dogs and some owner tells the kid not to be afraid. Meanwhile, just about any big dog is the size of a Shetland pony with respect to a two year-old. You are so right ! Reminds me of a dog I found in my garden with a medaille that said fugueur mais gentil. I called the owner that his cool dog had nearly sectioned my thumb. Apparently I was the first his dog had ever bitten. Sure i could have been smarter when he fought my dog and not intervene or kick it in the balls as I do now.
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Post by mickthecactus on Feb 2, 2020 19:27:00 GMT
Watching Countryfile tonight I was pleased to see lady shepherds are called shepherdesses.
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Post by bixaorellana on Feb 4, 2020 5:24:47 GMT
Good to know. My pet peeve is that some jackass has a car with either a horn alarm or a short in the horn parked somewhere on my street for the past several days. I think the owner must live nearby because whenever the *&@#$% thing goes off, as it does at all hours of the day and night, it does get turned off, usually not nearly as quickly as I'd like.
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Post by onlyMark on Feb 4, 2020 8:05:10 GMT
Bixa, you know car alarms will reset themselves after a period of time. It's not always the owner who is switching it off.
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Post by whatagain on Feb 4, 2020 12:59:06 GMT
Read it today in an internal mail : mrs xxxx ingénieure R&D blabla... Elle rapportera à yyyy
So it seems our communication experts in HR pay attention to gender.
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Post by bixaorellana on Feb 4, 2020 15:21:30 GMT
Bixa, you know car alarms will reset themselves after a period of time. It's not always the owner who is switching it off. Yeah, I know, except that sometimes it gets turned off rather quickly, more quickly that that sort of alarm usually takes to run its course. Even though I feel spasms of hatred when the damned thing starts honking just as I'm drifting off to sleep, I have some sympathy for the car's owner. There has been a run of car window breaking in my area the last three years or so, I assume with a view to stealing the car. That included a friend's big work truck which he'd parked right in front of my drive as a protective measure.
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Post by kerouac2 on Feb 4, 2020 16:09:35 GMT
I remember when car alarms first became popular and did not yet have the automatic shut off. There were times when you could hear 3 or 4 alarms at the same time in the middle of the night, interminably.
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Post by whatagain on Feb 9, 2020 9:19:09 GMT
I have probably got lice.
Hate that.
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Post by kerouac2 on Feb 9, 2020 11:29:45 GMT
Boy, you are ticking every box on the list these days.
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Post by bixaorellana on Feb 9, 2020 23:36:03 GMT
Ticks too?!
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Post by questa on Feb 10, 2020 0:02:53 GMT
Whatagain...I told you not to play with that Trump boy and his friends!
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Post by lagatta on Feb 10, 2020 0:45:31 GMT
Including his horrible, wildlife-killing sons.
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Post by casimira on Feb 11, 2020 16:55:17 GMT
I love to login here and peruse the Image Bank only to find soooo many fabulous pictures that once existed no longer available for viewing because of the Photobucket debacle. It makes me both sad and angry.
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