Women vs. Men

[Deleted]

Yes, the whole Mars/Venus deal.

We all agree that not everybody fits into the generalizations that may follow, but what are the main psychological differences that you have found between the two sexes?

Just to kick if off, I will say:

-Women often obsess about totally unimportant details.
-Men have very short memories (or no memory at all).
-Women want to be equal but they also want men to do things for them constantly.
-Men expect women to take care of most domestic details.

Is your blood boiling yet?

[Deleted]

Okay Kerouac, I'll stick my neck out here, (something we have in common)

Personally I don't think men and women will ever be completely 'equal'. After all men can't have babies and women are hardly ever seen working as loggers and such. There are certain things which are just more suited for men and the same applies to women.

I do believe in equal pay for equal work and rights however, but too much 'equality' can get boring. I actually like being a woman and all that it entails and I like doing 'girly' things for my man and I like the fact that my man does 'manly' things for me and in general. As long as it's all done with respect and consideration, it's a good thing.

[Kimby]

As long as we're AWARE of each others' differences, we should be able to get along just fine, right?

Also, I'm all for a gender-based division of labor IF it's negotiated by the parties involved. I don't WANT to do a lot of the shit my hubby has to do (work for a living, for example), and I'm happy to keep house and mow the lawn in exchange.

[Deleted]

Don't forget the leaf blower kimby!

[Kimby]

Actually HE uses the leaf blower, to blow the pine needles off the driveway so he can bounce his basketball.

[Deleted]

That's what they all say

[Kimby]

He plays "buckets" while I fix dinner.
And sometimes he uses the string-trimmer (a.k.a. weed whacker) to trim around trees and planter beds after I've mowed the lawn. (Do you hate string trimmers, too, casi, or just leaf blowers?)

[Deleted]

I hate all of those noise machines but leaf blowers send me over the edge. No, I don't use weed whackers either. But this is not the place for this discussion. I was only playing with you kimby. I couldn't resist.

[traveler63]

First of all, what is versus mean? There was a journalist by the name of Sydney J. Harris who worked as a syndicated journalist for many years. Back in 1982 He wrote a book called Pieces of Eight, a collection of his essays. Once of these is called Equality is not Identity and I am going to put it in this post because I think it is great food for thought. It refers to equality as is described in our American Declaration of Independence but I think it has some insights that may pertain to this posting.

EQUALITY IS NOT IDENTITY

Will everybody please write on the blackboard one hundred times the sentence; Equality and identity are not the same thing. You have to learn this if you are going to understand what the Declaration Of Independence means and also if you want to understand what "equality between the sexes" means or ought to mean.
Equality and identity are not the same thing. "All men(this is mankind) are created equal". Obviously this does not mean identical; All people are not the same size, the same shape, do not have the same brains and the same talent and the same anything. Only identical twins are identical.
We are created equal in that our differences must be treated the same under the law. In that everyone is entitled to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. In that everyone possesses the same rights, regardless of birth, wealth, health, wisdom, or shoe size.

That is what the frames of the Declaration meant -- this and nothing more. We insult their memory by assuming that they supposed all people to be alike, or identical, so that differences did not count. But differences must not count in respect to the basic worth of each individual.
Now, two hundred years later, we face the same confusion and misunderstanding about equality for women. Women are equal to men, but they are not identical: Their anatomy is different, their physiology is different, and these differences create difference in temperament and attitude.
Women cannot do everything as well as men do, no can men do all that women can. It is simple justice to give women equal rights under the law, it is absurd to suggest, as some ardent feminists do, that women are identical to men in all capacities. The differences are real and cannot be obliterated; but the rights and responsibilities of each must be fairly apportioned, as they demonstrably are not today.
Some of the more strident feminists seem to want to turn women into men manque+--to ignore the inborn biological differences. But this in my view is an insult to women, because it takes the male as a model and insists that women can live up to this model. But woman is her own model, with her own particular resources and aptitudes, and not just a slightly weaker or slower male.

"As good as" does not mean "the same as" The goodness in women is complementary to the goodness in men, not an imitation or a rival. Each kind of goodness deserves equal treatment in all respects, legally, economically and socially. E pluribus unum is as sensible a motto for the sexes as for the states

Remember this was written sometime before 1982 and it obviously directed toward Americans.

I will be curious to see what you all think.

[Deleted]

I like that, 'equality is not identity'. Well put travel63. We don't have to be the same to feel equal.

[tigronne]

It's strange that everytime this topic is raised, it's always about difference (something everyone is well aware of by now, seen the searth of literature, and jokes, on the subject), why not look at what we have in common instead.

Well just like when people want to be friends, or at the very least get on with each other, well we tend to look at what we have in common instead of the opposite.

Unless I'm missing the point entirely and there are forces at work ensuring a perpetual struggle and competition between the sexes.

[Deleted]

No,tigronne,you're not missing the point and thanks for weighing in. (The only difference I see between us ,is that you're a guest,and a most welcome one I, would like to add).Cheers!

[lola]

Hey, K,

I have my own little stereotype storehouse, but oddly only your fourth one overlaps with mine.

Bear in mind that I like men, and some of my BEST friends are men.
-- Men have one-track minds in the sense that they seem able to cope with only one task at a time.
-- If someone is a busybody, constantly intruding in others' business, or a teacher's pet type, it's likely to be a she
-- If someone constantly puts #1 first, it's probably a he.
-- Would one of the details women constantly obsess about be basic bathroom cleanliness?

[Jazz]

Perhaps the reason that 'women often obsess about totally unimportant details' is simply that men and women think that different things are important.

Men have very short memories (or none at all). I see no differences between the sexes here, unless you are hinting that men 'forget' arguments and manfully rise above such things? No, although often it is in the best interest of the man to rewrite history.

'Women want to be equal but expect men to do things for them constantly'. Call me a wild romantic, but in the good relationships that I have seen, the two often enjoy doing 'womanly' and 'manly' things for each other. Or, simply complementing each other in infinite ways...perhaps the man is the finer chef and enjoys preparing meals, while the woman finds it a bore.

I confess that I have never understood men and do find them to be almost a different species. This difference fascinates me and I love it. Most men that I have known have great difficulty expressing and talking about feelings. This seems to be frightening for them and to be avoided at all costs. Perhaps it's just me, but we have a totally different world vision of what is important. I find men to be far less empathetic, tending to dismiss much of what women need as 'trivial'. There is much more violence, verbally and physically, in men.

Since this is purely subjective and my generalizations, it seems that in most of the long term relationships that I have known, the women know how to 'manage' the men. ;D The men are somewhat deferred to in a public situation, while privately I listen to the woman's frustration and anger. This probably relates to a woman's empathetic skills. What surprises me is that when I ask, did you say this to him? (in private), the answer is often, 'No!'

These are just a few of my thoughts about some of the psychological differences between the sexes. Difference is intriguing to me. The struggle for gender equality in terms of the law, in infinite ways, has been long and hard and is still going on.

[Deleted]

It is a well known fact the women control men with cleverness while men often resort to brute force to control women.

[lagatta]

I agree with everything Jazz says except perhaps the verbal violence. Perhaps not so much with men as it isn't in our interest, but women can be extremely cutting - downright caustic - with other women.

Do you think the generalisations we have been talking about here apply only to heterosexual men and women, or also to gays and lesbians?

My gay and lesbian friends seem to have pretty much the same problems in their relationships as straight people do.

[lola]

K, I sometimes think how much better off my husband would be with a clever manager type who knew how to manipulate him. I lack that knack, and he remains raw material.

(Though this would leave me without any management duties. Oh, well.)

I work with mostly women, and they tend to be very supportive of each other. My regular coffee group is, if anything, too reluctant to gossip for my taste.

[Kimby]

Aug 3, 2009 17:09:43 GMT kerouac2 said:

It is a well known fact the women control men with cleverness while men often resort to brute force to control women.

I thought women controlled men with sex, or the denial of sex.

[Deleted]

Stop being clever, kimby!

[rikita]

and again... i guess i better stay out of this, much too late to write pages and pages...

[Kimby]

Men give backrubs to get sex.
Women give sex to get their backs scratched.


(In my case anyway!)

[Deleted]

Hmmm... have you tried a psoriasis cream?

[Kimby]

Doesn't your back ever itch, K2?

No rash, no bug bite, nothing there but the itch. If I could reach it, I'd scratch it myself because it's certainly easier to hit the right spot oneself than to hope someone else figures it out.

(Hmmm...sounds kinda like sex in that regard!)

[Deleted]

Aha! The 7 year itch! Maybe a 14 year or 21 year relapse!

[Kimby]

Try 25.

[imec]

My understanding is some men have to put up with a scratched back if they want sex

[Kimby]

Ooh, good one, imec

I heard some men LIKE a scratched back.

Maybe we women with itchy backs can train our men to scratch OUR backs during sex.

[Deleted]

Don't let Deyana anywhere near this thread. She has at least 27 scratchy fingers.

[Kimby]

Aug 17, 2009 19:44:17 GMT Kimby said:

Maybe we women with itchy backs can train our men to scratch OUR backs during sex.

Unfortunately, I've trained my man to like having his own back scratched. He just blisses out while I'm scratching his itches.

So I'm doing more scratching than being scratched these days. :-(