|
Post by imec on Oct 9, 2009 13:55:56 GMT
I do enjoy a good cup of coffee. I DON'T enjoy the worship of the coffee bean and the whole religion that has sprung up around it with its temples (coffee bars), high priests (baristas) and ceremonial sacrifices ($5 for a cup of coffee? come on... ).
Starbucks embodies everything I dislike about coffee culture. Listen to "the voice of the people" put Starbucks into perspective.
WARNING: If you either LOVE Starbucks or HATE swearing, DO NOT watch this.
|
|
|
Post by lagatta on Oct 9, 2009 14:11:46 GMT
I hate snobby "coffee culture" - moreover Starbucks coffee isn't even good - but I also hate dishwater North American "coffee". I live in la Petite Italie and the old coffee bars here are working-class institutions - fortunately nowadays it is not unseemly for women to go to most of them, though a few still seem to cater to elderly men from one particular Italian village or the supporters of one calcio (soccer-football) side.
Caffè Italia opens at 5am, as a lot of builders go there, they also get cops, ambulance drivers and other earlies that time of day. I was worried one day as they had a sign that they'd be closed for the day for "renovations" but the aforementioned reno amounted to a badly-needed new coat of paint. Still has old brown linoleum tables.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 9, 2009 14:22:52 GMT
It appears that Starbucks is beginning to shrink. And not a moment too soon.
|
|
|
Post by fumobici on Oct 9, 2009 15:38:16 GMT
Starbucks is an emasculated, prissified, overpriced reinvention of the Italian bar. Every once in a great while if I need an espresso and there is no alternative, I'll grit my teeth and get one there. In its earliest days Starbucks was actually fairly authentic. I can remember in Seattle when there were none of the pretentious decor, ridiculous milkshake abominations, or that creepy new age huckster vibe- just espresso with or without a bit of milk. No bar is authentic though that can't make you a caffè corretto or a spremuta d'arancia.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 10, 2009 11:26:52 GMT
This is what was once the local bank in my home town(they have moved to another location). It has been there several years now and I positively shudder when I go visit and see it. When they first opened a few years ago,as a joke, I went in there with my old savings bank book that had a few dollars left in it as I never closed out the account. I presented it to the "barrista" and asked for my money. The poor woman was totally flummoxed,and called over the manager. (the huge brass vault still stands behind the counter) and I motioned toward it. They had no idea that it had previously been a bank and dismissed me as some "nut job". My friends were highly amused,the Starbucks people were not.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 10, 2009 14:50:01 GMT
Even though I have never set foot in Starbucks, I approved of this one when I saw it in the Miami area, because I was happy to see something else replace a service station with a certain cleverness.
|
|
|
Post by lagatta on Oct 10, 2009 15:39:22 GMT
That is clever, but I detest the whole idea of drinking coffee in cars, unless you are a long-distance trucker, and even then it is healthier if you can stop and stretch your legs, have a coffee and a pee. My favourite such transformation is a former Kentucky Fried Grease joint on Dalhousie Street in Lower Town, Ottawa (an old district near the Byward farmers' market and the bridge to the Québec side). It has become a Portuguese grill restaurant. Family place, still a lot of chicken, no doubt sardines and other things. You can see the KFC architecture as redecorated in the pic: casadochurrasco.tripod.com/
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 10, 2009 18:32:10 GMT
Starbucks has taken over every other street corner in NYC. I intentionally go out of my way to try and find the small independent coffee shops closest to a Starbucks when I'm in NY for this very reason. The only time I go into a Starbucks is one here in NOLA that is really close to a jobsite and I use the bathroom in that one as it is really close to the rear exit and no one ever bothers me. They do keep a clean restroom.
|
|
|
Post by hwinpp on Oct 12, 2009 8:42:49 GMT
I've had coffee at Starbucks on two or three occasions.
Has anybody tried their instant coffee mixes yet?
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 12, 2009 10:45:39 GMT
No hw. but I imagine they are very pricey. Best stick with your Nescafe.
|
|
|
Post by lagatta on Oct 12, 2009 13:02:47 GMT
I've seen a Nescafé instant espresso in supermarkets here - a little more expensive than the usual stuff, but not pricy. Is it any good (as emergency supplies that is, or to get a good coffee taste in tortes and such)?
I'm sure Starbucks "coffee drink" mixtures will be full of sugar and funny fats.
|
|
|
Post by patricklondon on Oct 12, 2009 13:31:23 GMT
Real coffee is instant coffee, near as dammit.
Neither Italian nor Starbucks is the only coffee culture. Personally I like filter or cafétière coffee, and I like it black around 11am. Why is it that I always manage to find myself stuck in a queue behind people buying those time-consuming bastard (scuse my French) cappuccinos, not to mention all those other weird pseudo-Italian-sounding innovations?
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 12, 2009 20:06:46 GMT
I am happy to still live in a place where 95% of the people will drink espresso if they want coffee away from home. Café au lait is a breakfast drink, and the other concoctions are for tourists.
This said, I find it odd that in countries as close to France as Belgium or Switzerland, coffee is systematically served with milk (in separate doses) if you do not give specific instructions.
|
|
|
Post by lagatta on Oct 12, 2009 22:42:11 GMT
Cappuccino is a breakfast drink as well, just as caffè latte (and café con leche) are.
|
|
|
Post by fumobici on Oct 12, 2009 22:51:46 GMT
In Italy the barista may make you a cappuccino past 10:30 or 11:00 on request. But you will be forever branded a philistine. It's like saying buongiorno at 17:00- unthinkable Oddly though, one can order a caffè macchiato (espresso with perhaps a spoonful of steamed milk) well into the evening without the slightest loss of social standing.
|
|
|
Post by bixaorellana on Oct 12, 2009 23:00:21 GMT
A word about "re-purposing" buildings. I don't understand being against Starbucks about this. If those buildings aren't bought by a concern for the original usage, what will happen to them? There's pretty much nothing uglier than an abandoned filling station, and old bank buildings are generally only preserved by some cutesy use, such as Starbucks. Here is the old bank building in my home town. Just across the road from this well-maintained building is the original jailhouse of the town. It's an interesting building and well-situated, yet is empty, with only some wood-butchery plywood partitions inside to show a misbegotten attempt at re-purposing it. I'm not at all a fan of Starbucks, but obviously many people are or it wouldn't enjoy the vast success it's had. I'd think someone with the dough to buy a Starbucks franchise could save a building like that jailhouse. Certainly seeing it in use with tables, chairs, potted plants and relaxed customers inside and out doesn't seem to me a bad thing.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 13, 2009 2:00:11 GMT
I can see your point B. but in many,many instances both here and in NY, NYC in particular,Starbucks will target an area that has several independently owned coffee shops and attempt to run them out of business. There was a big stink about this in NYC some years back in the area around Columbia University. The neighborhood was successfully able to keep them out. Here, in NOLA they put one in on Maple Street within a 1 1/2 blocks of 2 well established independents.
|
|
|
Post by bixaorellana on Oct 13, 2009 4:06:00 GMT
I understand what you're saying, but the problem is that they get clients, so they stay in business. A big company like that does all kinds of demographic studies that tell it a franchise will be successful in a certain neighborhood and forsooth -- they get the customers. It would be wonderful to think that the one on Maple St. would wither & die from lack of business, but for every loyal customer of the local coffee shop, there are two college students and three Jr. League mamas thrilled beyond measure that there's now a Starbucks.
Anyway, my point was that in examples such as that you mentioned with the defunct bank or the former gas station Kerouac showed, it's kind of nice that a building got upkeep and use instead of plywooded windows and blowing trash accumulating on its lot.
|
|
|
Post by traveler63 on Oct 13, 2009 9:10:54 GMT
I know I said no more posts but I just have to on this one. Everytime we walk by the Starbucks on Avenue de Opera we snicker!!!!! No way and we practically have to twist the people's arms not to serve us Cafe Americane, and when we say espresso se vous plait, they raise their eyebrows as if to say really?
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 13, 2009 10:00:28 GMT
B.,I know they have marketing experts that study the demographics. That irks me too ,to some degree,that corporate strategist thing. Yes,I know it's what this country is based on etc. etc.,the whole free enterprise thing. In the case of the bank in Bridgehampton. There was (is) no way that building would lay empty. That is primo Hamptons real estate,a gazillion businesses were vying for that space,some local,some corporate. Guess who got it.The other thing about that building is, where on Main Street it is located. On the way out of town heading East for all those people who still have another hour or so drive to their fancy homes. It does not lure or encourage it's clients into the other shops on Main Street. It's designed as a quick stopover to keep moving. Rarely,are there people sitting in there lingering over their lattes and then meandering out to the sidewalks to shop.They refused to put a bench out front when asked. All their products are sold "to go". Their strategists figured that out too.
|
|