Thailand/Malaysia or Indonesia

[tigronette]

Hello,

I would like to pick the brains of any seasoned SE Asian travellers on this board. We plan on going to Singapore in november for 4-5 weeks and I can't decide where to go exactly (one month inSingapore does seem a bit long). We could either head up through Malaysia and Thailand and on to Laos if there's time (I would really like to see this last country) but we don't want to take the plane, if possible.

The other solution would be to head down into Indonesia (Sumatra as it's just next door, Java and maybe Borneo if we've got time).

My SO is dead set on diving in the area so that may weigh in our decision.

Any recs?

Thanks

Tigronette

[Deleted]

I have crossed Java by both train and bus and very much enjoyed it. Indonesia is much less overrun with Western tourists than the other countries, which is both an advantage and a handicap. In any case, one month in Singapore as a tourist would definitely be far too long (and yet it is one of the places where I could imagine living, except that I would not be a tourist anymore).

Laos is sensational, as is the rest of Indochina. It is still truly a "land that time forgot" (even more so than Cambodia, which is developing fast) except for Luang Prabang. I have fond memories of staying in a hotel in Vientiane that was built by the French in the 1930's and then re-equipped by the Soviets in the 1970's (delight museum pieces with cyrillic markings on the refrigerator, television and air conditioner). I felt like a war correspondant in hiding. However, on my second trip, I decided that it was perhaps not the best value in town at US$25 a night, even if the 'suite' was 40m² and I moved after one night to a Chinese hotel at US$10 with a fabulous rooftop view of Vientiane being gobbled by vegetation.

[hwinpp]

I'm not a diver T, so I can't comment much on that bit except I know Sipadan on the northeast coat of Borneo and the Gilis in eastern Indonesia are world famous.
Thailands Gulf coast islands seem to be a bit overdived and are known more for getting the PADI certification.
The islands off the Andaman coast are better but you have to go by boat and live aboard.

You should have a look at the websites of both Jetstar and Air Asia to at least go one way by air.

4- 5 weeks should be good if you fly to Vientiane and come back down all the way to Singapore overland (or vice versa).

Itin:

Singapore- Vientiane (the sleepiest capital in SEA, see temples, the vertical runway, the That Luang)- Luang Pabang (old capital, UNESCO world heritage site, see Mount Pouxi, temples, hill tribe villages, handicrafts, colonial architecture, try LP food, a distinct cuisine, very different from that in the Mekong valley)- Huay Xai (get there by the famous/infamous/notorious slow boat, much less crowded going up river, from Huay Xai try the Gibbon Experience, supposed to be good, I never went)- Chiang Mai (cross the Mekong from Huay Xai, get bus to CM either direct or via Chiang Rai, lots to see and do around there, cruise the Ping River on bamboo raft etc., etc.)- Sukhothai (old legendary capital, ruins)- Lop Buri- Ayuthaya (also old capital, the one before Bangkok, sacked by the Burmese)- Bangkok (get a cruise on an old rice barge to Bangkok)- Chumphon (jumping off point for the ferry to Ko Tao)- Ko Phangan- Ko Samui- Surat Thani (island hop all the way from Ko Tao)- Penang- Kuala Lumpur- Malacca- Singapore.
If you haven't had your fill of beaches by then do a short island getaway by air.

Or:

Singapore- Vientiane then go south.
Vientiane- Savannakhet- Pakse- Cambodia (Phnom Penh- Siem Reap)- Bangkok then continue as above or get an Air Asia flight from Siem Reap to Kuala Lumpur and do your beach time on Pulau Tioman off the east coast of peninsular Malaysia (though December might already see the monsoon).

Indonesia should be largely dry in November but I've not much of a clue. I've only been to Sumatra and Java, I'm not much of a beach person and the weather doesn't faze me

Think about Cambodia, not bad at all and November is a good time...

[tigronette]

Thanks for replying, looks like it's going to be Singapore/Malaysia/Sumatra and as much of Java as we can fit in. Pulau Weh is a pretty good dive site off the tip of N Sumatra that sounds just like what we're looking for.

The laos / Singapore trip sounds great but I just don't have enough time to do this without booking an extra flight (and there's no way I'm doing that, see my rant on the death of the ferry which was partly in jest, but we are serious about not booking extra flights). Maybe next time...

[bazfaz]

I agree with K that Singapore seems the kind of place to live rather than spend weeks as a tourist. Two days and then off.

You could take a train all the way up Malaysia. I don't feel qualified to give advice because the only time I holidayed in Malaysia I was unhappy in my marriage and this adversely affected my opinions about the country.

But take the train into Thailand and get off at Surat Thani. 99% of people will be going to Ko Samui (which was still nice when I saw it 24 years ago but I would avoid it now). Instead take the bus to Khao Sok national park and spend 4 nights at Our Jungle House. Take the tour to the dammed lake - every bit as good as Ha Long in Vietnam but with almost no tourists. Then get back on the train and have a first class sleeper to Bangkok.

After Bangkok take the train to Ayuthaya; two nights. Then the overnight train to Chiang Mai. We liked CM; there are nice places around to visit and I did a 5 day cooking course there.

You can then take a bus to the Mekong - Chiang Khan. You can come down the river neither on the fast boat (seriously damage your eardrums and spine) nor the slow boat (uncofortable and dreadful night half way down). Instead take the Nagi; it does the trip in one day in considerable comfort. Go to Luang Prabang. It is touristy but good. We then backtracked a bit and took a small boat up the Ou to Nong Khiaw. That is a backwater but some lovely countryside. Then back to LP.

We then flew to Vientiane though it is possible to go by bus on a couple of routes. I wasn't very enthusiastic about Vientiane but you can then easily cross back into Thailand at Nong Khai. The place to stay here is Mut Mee, right on the Mekong. I recommended it to IanUK (of TTR) and he and his wife loved it so much they stayed 10 days, hiring a little motorbike and travelling around.

Then you can either take the train back to BKK. Or take a cheap taxi to Ubon Thani (I think) and fly to BKK and then back to Singapore.

Of course I could do you a whole different holiday in Thailand!

[hwinpp]

Sept 1, 2009 8:20:46 GMT tigronette said:

Thanks for replying, looks like it's going to be Singapore/Malaysia/Sumatra and as much of Java as we can fit in. Pulau Weh is a pretty good dive site off the tip of N Sumatra that sounds just like what we're looking for.

...

That won't work without an extra flight either Easpecially if you want to stay in Java until the last minute.
Check the Pelni shipping schedule for boats from Jakarta or Surabaya to Bintan or Batam, the closest Indonesian islands to Singapore with regular ferries.

There are ferries from Penang to Lawang (closest port for Medan, could be Bandar Aceh) and from Malacca to Dumai. Those would get you to north/central Sumatra.

When are you planning on going? Check the weather patterns.

[Deleted]

Hmmm.... I wonder if today's big earthquake will perturb anything.

[spindrift]

I wouldn't bother going to Vientiane.

[Deleted]

Maybe not on this trip, but I loved the slow forgotten atmosphere of it. I was thinking when I was there that it might be the sleepiest national capital in the world.

[hwinpp]

Agree with Jack. I really liked Vientiane. The ideal place to relax.