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Post by Deleted on Oct 26, 2009 14:10:26 GMT
I've noticed that some men claim to 'love' women, and yet seem to dislike them in other ways.
They like them for the obvious feminine contributions they make, but will try and keep them back in other ways. It's almost like they are too insecure to treat them as complete equals. Simple things like not wanting their wife or partner to learn to drive. (I've seen this a few times), or never acknowledging their achievements or celebrating in their partners personal successes. This type of man will put women down they work with too, sometimes with sexist jokes etc.
I wonder how some men get into that mind set? Is it insecurity on their part? Are they afraid that if their woman becomes too independent she may not need him anymore? What exactly is this all about.?
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Post by spindrift on Oct 26, 2009 15:28:02 GMT
This is a failure I have often observed in my partners and my girlfriend's partners. It's always the same story. The man, by withholding praise, encouragement and approval, seeks to keep the woman anxious and always trying harder to please him. Anyway, that's my view.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 26, 2009 15:53:49 GMT
So it's like a control issue? The man feels that by not encouraging her or by not complimenting her on her personal achievements, he will keep her trying to please him in other ways to compensate for what is 'lacking' in her?
It amazes me how many men will play these kind of mind games, and how many women do fall for it. I think I'd want out of such a relationship as soon as possible. This so reminds me of my first marriage, no wonder it only lasted just over 2 years.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 27, 2009 5:31:08 GMT
I have observed that, too -- not in myself, thank god.
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Post by tillystar on Oct 27, 2009 7:18:43 GMT
I think these men love the idea of a woman but can't cope with the real thing.
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Post by bazfaz on Oct 27, 2009 8:02:01 GMT
Mrs Faz's first husband was like that. That was my good fortune since I was bound to be an improvement.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 27, 2009 11:12:46 GMT
I think so much of it is learned behavior that carries over from generation to generation.
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Post by happytraveller on Oct 27, 2009 12:53:59 GMT
I think so much of it is learned behavior that carries over from generation to generation. That is so true ! |
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Post by imec on Oct 27, 2009 13:11:59 GMT
I think you're all reading far too much into this. They're just shitheads - and btw, they come in all flavours and at least two sexes.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 27, 2009 13:17:32 GMT
 . I agree that both genders play a role.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 27, 2009 15:41:38 GMT
Yes, but the traditional gender roles still dominate the game and therefore the problem.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 27, 2009 17:18:13 GMT
I think you're all reading far too much into this. They're just shitheads Yep they are, and plenty of them around too. And what Kerouac said. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 27, 2009 18:57:58 GMT
Maybe for some of them it's a mixture of not only wanting to be 'in control' of the woman/man in their lives, and not only a lack of self-confidence in themselves, but just plain old jealousy? They feel inadequate so in order to feel better they need to find a way to make the other person feel worse/inadequate too?
Actually 'shitheads' probably hits it on the head.
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Post by imec on Oct 27, 2009 20:31:21 GMT
We tend to want to come up with all sorts of explanations to rationalize what is simply unacceptable behavior. They deserve no such defense - shitheads I say!
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Post by Deleted on Oct 27, 2009 23:21:13 GMT
;D
I like the way you word things!
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Post by Jazz on Oct 28, 2009 2:05:00 GMT
There are two types of abuse, emotional and physical. This thread seems to address emotional abuse, the most insidious and difficult to deal with. It is usually silent and secret. Being female, this is my perspective...yes, females abuse males, but this isn't common. I agree most with Spindrift and Imec.
Spindrift: #1, 'It is always the same story. The man, by withdrawing praise, encouragement and approval, keep the woman anxious and always trying harder to please him.'
I think that it is definitely a 'control' issue. I have often seen this with women. The question is, why does she stay?
Erratic behaviour of the Abuser. He demeans her. She, of little self esteem, accepts this or puts up a brief and futile fight. He now becomes 'briefly nice'. She, happy and encouraged, responds accordingly. He now 'whacks' her again. She is confused, often apologizes for her 'unseemly' protest of his sadistic abuse. He enjoys this. This goes on and on.
The silence of the Abused. Feeling hurt, demoralized, guilty and (now) thoroughly deserving of the abuse, she tells no one. People woud of course be critical of physical abuse (ie: black eye, bruises...)...but with emotional abuse, there are no witnesses. Silent, hidden.
A way of thinking. No matter what, we all seem to think that we think the same. We do not. What is abusive to me me is sadistic entertainment to another.
When all is said and done, I agree with Imec, ' We tend to want to come up with all sorts of explanations to rationalize what is semply unacceptable behaviour. They deserve no such defense. Shitheads I say!'
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Post by imec on Oct 28, 2009 2:50:39 GMT
A great analysis Jazz - and certainly more eloquent than mine.
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Post by cristina on Oct 28, 2009 3:08:53 GMT
Jazz,
I think your assessment/observations are right on. The only thing that I would add is that is probably as equally common for the woman in a partnership to display these abusive behaviors. I just think it is far less talked about.
Its still shithead behavior, no matter where it originates from.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 28, 2009 12:56:39 GMT
You put that really Jazz.
Talking about low self-esteem, where does that come from? I think the abuser has as much issues with this as the person he or she is abusing. Does it perhaps stem from childhood? I've seen people, (men and women), who you would think have no need to have self-esteem issues at all, but very definitely do. I think perhaps there ought to be classes out there to teach people how to look at themselves in a better light.
Maybe some of the 'control' issues and shitheadness that comes later on could then be avoided.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 28, 2009 13:18:35 GMT
. I think that it is definitely a 'control' issue. I have often seen this with women. The question is, why does she stay? The usual reply is; 'because I love him'. Or perhaps she feels that she does, after all he is trying to make sure that her emotions are all over the place. Perhaps she sees this confusion as a kind of affection?... Not sure. |
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Post by rikita on Oct 29, 2009 22:04:36 GMT
i guess in some cases it is because it is a behaviour or dynamics she recognizes, so even though they are wrong, they feel safe - while if someone actually treats her (or him, if it is the other way around) nice, she/he keeps wondering what there might be behind it, like not trusting it to be true.
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. I agree that both genders play a role.
